DTC and wheelies.

Discussion in 'Multistrada' started by johnv, Jun 4, 2012.

  1. johnv

    johnv Senior Member

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    Does anyone know where I can find a definitive explanation of how the DTC works on the Multistrada ?

    Not a general overview, but the detail. In particular I would like to know whether there is a pseudo anti wheelie function where the rotational speed of the front wheel is compared to the rear wheel to limit the extent to which the bike can wheelie.

    Clearly the Multistrada can be wheelied but what effect, if any, does the TC setting have ?
  2. wheels

    wheels Member

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    I don't even remember where I got this, if it's in the manual or what

    .Operating principle of DTCThe DTC function integrated in the BBS controls engine torque delivery to prevent
    loss of rear wheel grip. The BBS receives the angular speed signals relative to the
    front and rear wheels. In relation to the wheel diameter and tyre cross section, these
    signals is converted into the tangential speed values for the front and rear wheels. The
    vehicle speed is ascertained from these values and transmitted to the dashboard over
    the CAN network. If the tangential speed of the rear wheel exceeds the tangential
    speed of the front wheel by a given percentage, this indicates that the rear wheel is
    wheelspinning excessively. At this point the DTC intervenes, requesting the ECU to
    reduce engine torque. A number of other sensors are also included inside the BBS to
    determine if the vehicle is wheelying, in which case the DTC will not intervene until
    a predetermined vehicle speed is reached. To ensure that the Ducati Traction Control
    functions correctly, never fit tyres other than those authorised by Ducati. On the
    Multistrada 1200 there are 8 different DTC levels (from 1 to 8):
    • 1 – 2 permit a high degree of rear wheelspin (DTC has a limited engine torque
    reduction action) and are used for riding the bike on gravel roads. Enduro riding
    • 3 – 4 permit a normal degree of rear wheelspin and are used for sports riding.
    Sports riding
    • 5 – 7 reduce rear wheelspin and are used for Touring or Urban riding
    • 8 significantly reduces rear wheelspin (DTC has a substantial engine torque
    reduction action) and is used for riding on wet tarmac. Rain riding
  3. johnv

    johnv Senior Member

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    Thanks for that wheels, from what you have posted there is a clear implication that DTC will intervene during a wheelie as the front wheel slows down after it looses contact with the road.

    Does anyone have any practical experience of wheelying the Multistrada and can they shed any light on this topic. Was any DTC intervention noticed and what was the TC level set at ?
  4. MJW61

    MJW61 Active Member

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    Yeah, try cranking the throttle on in the wet in Sport mode and feel Ducati nanny blink at you and withhold the joy-it's pretty bloody good.
    DTC works. Big time.
  5. Richard H

    Richard H Active Member

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    DTC or not, nothing is going to persuade me to pin the throttle open when that front wheel is already in the air, anyone feeling brave!
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2012
  6. wheels

    wheels Member

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    My settings for Dtc are factory. If I spin the rear pretty good it will kick in. I power wheelie it all the time and the Dtc never kicks in. I think at one point I dialed it to 2, but the battery has been disconnected since, so I imagine it's back to default settings. I'll check it when I get it back from the dealer, it's getting new fork seals and one leg at 10,000 miles.
  7. Bugsbunny

    Bugsbunny Member

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    You can't get it to wheelie at level 7 or 8, have tried - and it sort of holds u back.

    Bugs
  8. johnv

    johnv Senior Member

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    Thanks for that Bugs.

    Could you feel the front wheel skating on the road surface ?
  9. Bugsbunny

    Bugsbunny Member

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    Nope just like the engine felt struggly. Ran highest settings throughout jan to apr cause of rain. Did the job keeping it planted, now back level 3--5 depending on weather forecast for week.

    I adjust it over weekend for the weekly commute - always use enduro as the personal mode.
  10. johnv

    johnv Senior Member

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    So does this mean that within the DTC algorithms there is a system looking at inputs like speed, throttle setting, gear selection etc, with assumed tyre characteristics, to define a range of theoretical operating parameters that it will not go outside even though the rear wheel is not spinning relative to the front wheel ? Or did it intervene at the slightest hint of loss of rear wheel traction, on a wet road, well before the front wheel reached the point at which it would lift ?
  11. nelly

    nelly Active Member

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    There's quite a bit more going off than just looking at wheel speeds. This is taken from one of my tech documents....." A number of other sensors are also included inside the BBS to deter­mine if the vehicle is wheeling, in which case the DTC will not intervene until a predetermined vehicle speed is reached"....
    This predetermined speed on the 1198 was about 105mph i think. I had a customer find out :upyeah:Although when the ECU decided he was going fast enough on one wheel, it brings the front down with a crash :wink:
  12. Bugsbunny

    Bugsbunny Member

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    Not sure, thats way too tech-geek speak for me, I just notice that if you 'gun it' in the high DTC level, the bike just 'goes' and doesnt mis-behave with wheelies.
    not sure whats going on, and really unless you are aware that the setting is high you wouldnt even notice it. I only thought about the non-wheeling after a few weeks and remembered that the DTC was set to high, reducing it brought back the wheelie action.

    Dont remember any lights coming on or anything and no suptering, just a slight (not even that really) hesitation but still 'full power' forwards motion.

    I would just have a go yourselves, dtc set to high, rolling 1st or 2nd and gun it increasingly harder and harder, and you will find that the mutley will just go forwards not upwards.

    bugs
  13. Gilly76

    Gilly76 New Member

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    In my experience, 1st gear wheelies are no good as the DTC cuts in too quickly and spoils any fun, I assume that this is the differentail between front and rear being too much?

    However in 2nd or 3rd, 'clutched up' wheelies are fine and I don't get the DTC cutting in.

    HTH.
  14. johnv

    johnv Senior Member

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    Bugs, I think this is where I am heading but I wanted to get a good understanding of the theory first. I think you have answered my fundamental question which is that at high TC levels the bike will prevent wheelies.

    Gilly76, what mode and TC settings were you in at the time ?

    Presumably there is no reason why slightly different algorithms could be used with different weightings in different modes with different TC settings, the possibilities are almost limitless and no doubt the precise details of how the system works could be considered commercially sensitive.
  15. Gilly76

    Gilly76 New Member

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    In Sport, whatever the standard TC setting is for that mode.
  16. johnv

    johnv Senior Member

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    That would be 4.
  17. MJW61

    MJW61 Active Member

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    Have faith Rich, the DTC works very well.
  18. wheels

    wheels Member

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    Gilly can you check to see which setting yours is at? Mine will wheelie in 1st no dtc kicking in.

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