you dont need noob, burdie. exactly the opposite, apparently you need facts, compromise,agreement, cohesion.
Why would having a German wife and a lucrative career make Nigel Farage a hypocrite? In fact, not only is his wife German, his children were brought up to be bi-lingual and in his former career as a city metals trader (a successful and very well paid career which he gave up to pursue his political cause) he spent many years working for French company. There is nothing remotely hypocritical about any of this. Farage has never made any secret of his admiration for Europe the continent and its various nation states nor has he ever advocated that the UK should turn its back on European or cease to do business with our neighbours, quite the reverse in fact. He has said only that we should leave the political construct that is the EU and govern ourselves. Europe and the EU are two completely different things. The EU is not a country, it is a political project that has been constructed by a small cabal of people without any democratic mandate from the electorates of the nations of Europe and Farage's contention has always been that not only the UK but all the peoples of Europe would be freer and more prosperous without it.
hmm,burdies face palm is leaving me thinking noob just wasnt being a nob, i am genuinely thinking most dont understand devolution and the principles it's based on.
Au contraire. It is you who do not grasp its purpose. That's OK though, you have facts instead *smugfinger*
I know absolutely everything about it that I need to know. You want specifics though. I am happy to supply you with the specifics.
its all good birdie, . since brexit i have become more interested in the other three component parts of the uk and how they work., maybe i should of been before, maybe we all should of been before but hayho.
I'm not in favour of the EU as it stands today, mainly because after reading up on how it makes it's decisions and how MEP's can be overuled, I decided its fundamentally undemocratic. It needs to change. But equally, I am British & European, with strong ties in France and Spain. I favour common trade but not common politics. That said, I look at the generation effected by the financial fcuk-up crafted by the financial services sector. This includes my youngest son. It's taken 10 years for us to get back to a level of growth and employment we had in 2007 but he still cant afford a house. So now with Brexit, while I'm sure we can make a success of it, and maybe we'll come out the other side with 10% growth in GDP p.a. and zero unemployment, I wonder who is going to hurt while we spend another 10 years getting back to where we are today. Because that's how long it will take. At least. And it's not the people in power who will hurt. It's the ordinary man/woman in the street..... & their children. And a fair % of them voted for Brexit. Turkeys/Xmas
The fair % of them may well have suffered far worse than you have,and decided that any kind of possible Christmas is better than they have had. No one,not me/you/pollsters/the media/politicians...no one,has any knowledge or can say with any confidence why anybody EXCEPT THEMSELVES voted the way they did,nor does anyone have any right to criticise them for doing so. Everyones life experience differs,that experience leads people to hold different opinions. One thing that has been constant throughout this thread is the generalisation by some on how and why milions of other people’s opinions must be somehow not as worthy as the person contributing...when they know NOTHING of the ones they don’t know personally. I like hearing why the writer has voted the way the did,who they listened to,what they read and what they experienced that formed their opinions,and if I state something I will try to do the same myself.(at length...sorry!) Taking the piss/fact checking/seeking out possible bias/arguing the toss with folk on here is one thing,making derogatory comments and snide insults about people you know nothing about is another. Turkeys for Christmas indeed. Thats mild compared to to the finger pointing at the majority:racism,ageism,educational standard,social class...ffs how about giving it a rest and trying to convince us of how good life would be if Brexit hadn’t been voted for? And yeah I know,it’s a tired old drum I’m banging.
Sadly you may be right. In '73 we didn't get a vote and in '75 we were asked whether we wanted to stay in the Common Market, to which I said "yes". Only it wasn't a Common Market, it was a path to a Federal Europe via the EEC, EC and EU, slowly, one step at a time. There is a groundswell of opinion in the EU against Federalism, the Dutch PM just made great speech against Federalism, but the unelected leaders of the EU don't listen, because they know better, and that is why we have to leave.
I can't speak for everyone obviously, but this constant generalisation from remain supporters who suggest that a leave voter is racist, or xenophobic, is not only extremely naive for anyone remotely educated, but extremely blinkered to the reality of what the 'EU' is and how it operates The 'EU' in its political union form is not Europe. Europe is a land mass made up of individual countries, some of which are members of the EU economic and political union, some are not. Not being a fan of the EU is completely different to not being a fan of the multiple countries that reside within the land mass categorised as Europe. Negativity for the Eu isn't just about immigration, people form opinion based on how they feel about political organisations, for example lets take some of the EU's most influential figures, hardly the best front men for the job of proactively putting the EU and its setup in a positive light Junker, A man so elevated by his own self importance that trying to even give a scale to his arrogance and hypocrisy is really hard going. A man who spent his time as PM of Luxembourg clinging on to power by organising tax avoidance loop holes and secretly blocking reform from the EU at every turn when it suited him. The man ran one of the smallest countries in Europe, largely by being a crook, and yet he has a very outspoken and arrogant view on world affairs when in many cases it should have absolutely nothing to do with him and you could cut the hypocrisy with a butter knife. He's an absolute CU....sincerely, a massive massive Cu..... And then we have Guy Verhofstadt, a man whom I struggle to loath enough......I'm just not angry enough to manage the job of hate that this man deserves. In fact I almost respect him in a weird way because he's so bloody good at being the Dick......he's just outstanding at it, the gap toothed gypsy. So there you go, a rather measured assessment of some of my EU faves
I can't speak for everyone obviously, but this constant generalisation from remain supporters who suggest that a leave voter is racist, or xenophobic, is not only extremely naive for anyone remotely educated, but extremely blinkered to the reality of what the 'EU' is and how it operates. yip, it should be called out more often and a little less selectively no?.
Yes, it needs calling out more often because even now people still seem to be ignoring the fact they're acting like a bunch of arse holes. Unfortunately it's proven over the years that nobody is listening, or nobody can do anything about it, maybe a mixture of both There comes a point when people just get pissed off, ignoring that breeds what the ignorant politicians call 'populism' 'populism' as described by the majority of top brass EU isn't anything more than people having had enough of being told what to do, by a bunch of people they don't like.
finm would you please stop pasting and use the quote function properly. Your posts are giving me double vision.
its the way i roll dude, work with me. the logical one, on many occasions, in many places, mostly inappropriate, was v.quick to throw that label at me and others loz. silence. i have heard that way to often over the last few years from recognized and respected sources. i was reading an analysis on conservative election campaigns the other day, published in the Irish times, archived btw, the opinion, boiled down suggested they v.much use fear of the other as their core message. i totally got it. if i turns up again i will post it up. its an interesting read.
