1260 1260 Vs '15 Dvt - Back-to-back

phil street fighter · Apr 13, 2018

Rainman said: ↑

Picked up my 1260S Touring in white on Friday morning. Have only done 100 miles but thought I'd share my initial findings, much of which you probably have already have read about,

The display - big improvement, both in terms of readability and also the user interface. I never had a problem with the old screen but the new one is noticeably clearer. The interface is much more representative of a modern bike and not so much an 8-bit games console. Animated sequences on things like gear changes, display options, etc, is a nice touch.

Heated grips - a very noticeable improvement. On Friday it was +3c when I picked up my 1260. Once I got going I actually felt the need to lower the power to medium as my hands started to get a bit clammy inside my Dainese Scout Evo gloves. My hands were toasty, whereas the old DVT when it was approaching 0 degrees C you struggled to be able to tell if they were even on.

Gearbox - The quickshift is a little quirky compared to others I've used. If you leave your toe at the end of the upshift position for any period of time the ECU will see it as another shift and will cut the throttle briefly - data from the load cell isn't being processed after the change has happened, so the system can't tell whether your toe has gone back to where it was before the gear change happened, so timing of the shift sequence is partly down to you. Don't be lazy with your toe when shifting up and it's fine. The throttle cut timing is also hugely generous, resulting in a bit of a lurch during changes with a wider throttle opening. Whether this timing is something that gets better with higher revs we'll find out after the break-in period. Whilst this might sound like a criticism lets not forget that a lot of quick shifters need you to be working the engine above the first 1/3 of the rev range before they will work properly, but the 1260's QS works right off the bottom end at any revs. By comparison, on my MT10SP I tend to only use the QS when getting on the gas in the mid-range because it just doesn't play well below 4K rpm whereas the 1260's works pretty much everywhere. Aside from needing some slightly positive toe pressure there is nothing much to say about the auto-blipper because it is otherwise sublime. It's just effortless downshifts at any revs, exactly as it should be. Very happy with the system and an obvious plus over having nothing previously.

I'm having a small issue with finding neutral when stationary. If I roll to stop I can find neutral with the clutch in and still moving, but once I stop I'm just going 1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-turn-off-engine-N. It's a bit like it's overfilled with oil, and looking at the level on the oil spy-glass it looks like it just might be. I'll report back on this.

Engine - Simply put, this is how the '15 DVT should have been out of the box. Even after a continual release of new ECU code for the '15 DVT the low-down drive had seen some improvement but it's still not a patch on the 1260. The 1260 is just much more flexible even from just below 2K RPM and you will no longer get caught out in the wrong gear. Obviously, don't just grab a fistful at bugger-all revs because it will still feel a bit lumpy, but you don't have to nanny the throttle either - just ride and use the throttle normally and it behaves really well in the region between 1500 and 3K RPM, and upto 6K RPM its got much more drive and even very slight throttle adjustments translate really directly to forward momentum without being jerky. The old DVT I always felt I needed to make much more positive efforts to progress quickly - dropping a gear and whacking the throttle wide open, always thinking it was only able to deliver "just enough" to qualify as quick unless you felt like revving it right out, where it absolutely was quick, but that’s not where you spend 90% of your time when riding. Throughout the range permitted during the 1260's break-in (the period of which there is a virtual limiter in play) it feels like the engine is much more eager to spin - it’s a fair bit more lively. As a bit of a side issue, I often had the feeling with my old DVT that the starter motor wasn't well matched to the compression of the old 1200. When you thumbed the starter button it would turn over until it started to get near TDC and begin to stall until a spark lit the charge and fired it into life - which admittedly it did, very reliably. The 1260's lump just spins like a jap four on the starter. Probably just a better spec starter motor and beefier electrics in general to provide the appropriate amps to turn it over more confidently. I know this means nothing to performance but it adds to the overall impression of a much more sorted power-plant.

On the '15 DVT they improved the various throttle maps in the different modes on some of the ECU re-flashes, but I still felt the need to set my "Touring" mode to use the full-power and most aggressive setting. The 1260's un-tweaked "Touring" mode feels even better than that. Loads of drive and a much improved response, yet completely civilised. I won't be tweaking the "Touring" mode but I probably will bump up the engine setting in "Urban" mode, just because.

Handling - Well if they've softened the rake then I can't feel it in the areas where I thought I would. It still tips in easy on the initial turn-in on low speed corners. It all feels so familiar but high speed handling is noticeably more planted. Essentially, they've got this aspect completely spot on. You often read about geometry changes and shudder at the thought of the subtle tweaking having the effect of making the handling quirky or just ruined, but this isn't. It's just another very subtle improvement.

All up it's a whole raft of small changes, as has been reported in many places - maybe with the exception of the engine because to describe it as such would be to downplay it. Some of the differences are more nuanced, but within just the engine department those small differences add up to put a much wider smile on your face than that previous gen. The pure "twist'n'go at any revs" capability, which should be a factor on any litre-plus bike, is back and it's damned good.

I'm also noticing some improvements on fixtures and fittings. After 3 winters on the old DVT I know exactly where the weak points are in terms of corrosion on bolt-heads, etc. There are a few sets of bolts in obvious spots where there has clearly been an up-tick in quality. For example, wheel clamp bolts and those securing the pillion footrests appear to have more substantial finishes rather than just being left plain. We'll have a better idea over the last of these winter weeks but there does appear to have been some consideration that an all-can-do bike needs to be able to do it in all conditions, all year round.

So on reflection - having acquired the 1260S Touring without even test riding it, purely on the back of a couple of press reviews that confirmed that the new bike hasn't been ruined at least - am I happy that I've changed from my perfectly good '15 DVT? Actually, I am, and much more than I thought I would. It is all small changes but collectively I believe that they are more significant than the sum of their parts. For anyone wondering whether to change then it is an obviously better bike, in no small part because of the new engine. The journo's might all be saying that it's just a small update, but I doubt that any of them have lived with the previous bike for nearly 17,000 miles in 2 years and then ridden the '15 DVT and 1260 back-to-back.

I could now have a bit of a conundrum. I have two bikes in my garage, the Multi 1260S and an MT-10SP. The bike I previously took out of the garage reflected my mood or the requirement at the time. The '15 DVT would be the bike I'd take if I was just going to work, doing longer distances and touring, lugging some stuff around, etc, and the MT-10SP for when I just wanted to go out for a slightly more lively experience. I've got a distinct feeling that when the 1260S is broken in then that’s going to change. I don't think it's ever going to be as much of a hooligan as the Yam but the gap is surely going to be a narrower, but then it might just be that I've got "new bike syndrome". Only time will tell.
Click to expand...

have only done 80 milrs on it but agree with most things you have said, the heated grips are wow much better, torque is great from much lower down, shifter and blipper is a lot smoother than i ever thought possible and now im wandering how i ever managed without one on my last pikey, the marchasini wheels are just beautiful and finish the job off just right, as does the full termi. i have also the same issue with finding neutral when i pull up. think it might be something to do with the shifter maybe, dunno

Nigel Machin · Apr 13, 2018

phil street fighter said: ↑

have only done 80 milrs on it but agree with most things you have said, the heated grips are wow much better, torque is great from much lower down, shifter and blipper is a lot smoother than i ever thought possible and now im wandering how i ever managed without one on my last pikey, the marchasini wheels are just beautiful and finish the job off just right, as does the full termi. i have also the same issue with finding neutral when i pull up. think it might be something to do with the shifter maybe, dunno
Click to expand...

Finding Neutral gets much easier with a few more miles on the clock, 300 or so on mine and neutral is much much better

Veetwin · Apr 14, 2018

Now on my 4th Generation Multi and some 1400 miles in on a new 1260ST. In the past I had the original 2010 model with Ohlin's, then the twin spark 2013 followed by a 2015 DVT, all were the S versions and all did in excess of 25K miles.

Positives so far -

- The 1260 engine is excellent, perfect fuelling and lots of torque at all revs above 3K makes the bike deceptively quick. Much better than the DVT IMO.
- QS is good (a first for me), needs to be on the gas going up the box and is OK going down the box. Bit clunky in the lower gears when changing up and down. I still use the clutch for 1st to 2nd quite a bit. Neutral is easy to find now - took a while to bed in.
- Brakes feel really good, better than the DVT but the 1260 is still new.
- I like the new dash and menu system, easier to use than the DVT.
- Self cancelling indicators are very clever but I do still check!
- Heated Grips do deliver real heat another improvement on the DVT
- The rear shock drain hole actually does drain the water out - at last!
- I have the touring screen and that seems to be better on the 1260 than on the DVT for me.

Negatives so far -

- The standard seat is slippery and makes me slide forward, luckily the comfort seat from the DVT fits and is just fine - Could do better Ducati!
- The OE Chain rusts when it smells water! Ducati should fit a quality Gold DID Chain as standard.
- I am finding the clutch quite stiff, could be me or maybe to do with the QS? May look at a larger diameter Slave, I fitted the bigger Oberon slave on previous Multi's.
- Suspension! I have found the default suspension settings too soft for me especially in touring mode, still playing with the numerous settings to get it right, F & R preload etc.etc. I had Michelin Road 5s put on from new and the 1260 doesn't turn as quick as the other versions. Yes it is very stable at all speeds and holds the line perfectly, no twitching at all. I know the Rake and Swing Arm changes will affect the turn in and the small incremental changes made so far are making it feel better - this is all down to personal preference but I do miss the quick turn in of the previous generations. I am sure I will get it how I want it, just takes some time and miles to get it dialled in to how I want it.

Overall very happy with the 1260, it will be great on long trips and I feel that with the 1260 Ducati have made it more touring than sport orientated. I am OK with that as I do lots of miles and with the 1260 motor it can still deliver all the "sport" you need.

Needless to say the above is all my opinion, others may differ!

Nigel Machin · Apr 14, 2018

Veetwin said: ↑

Now on my 4th Generation Multi and some 1400 miles in on a new 1260ST. In the past I had the original 2010 model with Ohlin's, then the twin spark 2013 followed by a 2015 DVT, all were the S versions and all did in excess of 25K miles.

Positives so far -

- The 1260 engine is excellent, perfect fuelling and lots of torque at all revs above 3K makes the bike deceptively quick. Much better than the DVT IMO.
- QS is good (a first for me), needs to be on the gas going up the box and is OK going down the box. Bit clunky in the lower gears when changing up and down. I still use the clutch for 1st to 2nd quite a bit. Neutral is easy to find now - took a while to bed in.
- Brakes feel really good, better than the DVT but the 1260 is still new.
- I like the new dash and menu system, easier to use than the DVT.
- Self cancelling indicators are very clever but I do still check!
- Heated Grips do deliver real heat another improvement on the DVT
- The rear shock drain hole actually does drain the water out - at last!
- I have the touring screen and that seems to be better on the 1260 than on the DVT for me.

Negatives so far -

- The standard seat is slippery and makes me slide forward, luckily the comfort seat from the DVT fits and is just fine - Could do better Ducati!
- The OE Chain rusts when it smells water! Ducati should fit a quality Gold DID Chain as standard.
- I am finding the clutch quite stiff, could be me or maybe to do with the QS? May look at a larger diameter Slave, I fitted the bigger Oberon slave on previous Multi's.
- Suspension! I have found the default suspension settings too soft for me especially in touring mode, still playing with the numerous settings to get it right, F & R preload etc.etc. I had Michelin Road 5s put on from new and the 1260 doesn't turn as quick as the other versions. Yes it is very stable at all speeds and holds the line perfectly, no twitching at all. I know the Rake and Swing Arm changes will affect the turn in and the small incremental changes made so far are making it feel better - this is all down to personal preference but I do miss the quick turn in of the previous generations. I am sure I will get it how I want it, just takes some time and miles to get it dialled in to how I want it.

Overall very happy with the 1260, it will be great on long trips and I feel that with the 1260 Ducati have made it more touring than sport orientated. I am OK with that as I do lots of miles and with the 1260 motor it can still deliver all the "sport" you need.

Needless to say the above is all my opinion, others may differ!
Click to expand...

Agree with your findings, had a ride out today, first time 2 up and I stopped to check rear tyre, all was fine but stock suspension setting is too soft and ride height is lower than dvt, I’m 500 miles in now and loving the differences, a few tweaks here and there with the settings and it’ll be perfect

Groundhog · Apr 16, 2018

Rainman said: ↑

Picked up my 1260S Touring in white on Friday morning. Have only done 100 miles but thought I'd share my initial findings, much of which you probably have already have read about,

The display - big improvement, both in terms of readability and also the user interface. I never had a problem with the old screen but the new one is noticeably clearer. The interface is much more representative of a modern bike and not so much an 8-bit games console. Animated sequences on things like gear changes, display options, etc, is a nice touch.

Heated grips - a very noticeable improvement. On Friday it was +3c when I picked up my 1260. Once I got going I actually felt the need to lower the power to medium as my hands started to get a bit clammy inside my Dainese Scout Evo gloves. My hands were toasty, whereas the old DVT when it was approaching 0 degrees C you struggled to be able to tell if they were even on.

Gearbox - The quickshift is a little quirky compared to others I've used. If you leave your toe at the end of the upshift position for any period of time the ECU will see it as another shift and will cut the throttle briefly - data from the load cell isn't being processed after the change has happened, so the system can't tell whether your toe has gone back to where it was before the gear change happened, so timing of the shift sequence is partly down to you. Don't be lazy with your toe when shifting up and it's fine. The throttle cut timing is also hugely generous, resulting in a bit of a lurch during changes with a wider throttle opening. Whether this timing is something that gets better with higher revs we'll find out after the break-in period. Whilst this might sound like a criticism lets not forget that a lot of quick shifters need you to be working the engine above the first 1/3 of the rev range before they will work properly, but the 1260's QS works right off the bottom end at any revs. By comparison, on my MT10SP I tend to only use the QS when getting on the gas in the mid-range because it just doesn't play well below 4K rpm whereas the 1260's works pretty much everywhere. Aside from needing some slightly positive toe pressure there is nothing much to say about the auto-blipper because it is otherwise sublime. It's just effortless downshifts at any revs, exactly as it should be. Very happy with the system and an obvious plus over having nothing previously.

I'm having a small issue with finding neutral when stationary. If I roll to stop I can find neutral with the clutch in and still moving, but once I stop I'm just going 1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-turn-off-engine-N. It's a bit like it's overfilled with oil, and looking at the level on the oil spy-glass it looks like it just might be. I'll report back on this.

Engine - Simply put, this is how the '15 DVT should have been out of the box. Even after a continual release of new ECU code for the '15 DVT the low-down drive had seen some improvement but it's still not a patch on the 1260. The 1260 is just much more flexible even from just below 2K RPM and you will no longer get caught out in the wrong gear. Obviously, don't just grab a fistful at bugger-all revs because it will still feel a bit lumpy, but you don't have to nanny the throttle either - just ride and use the throttle normally and it behaves really well in the region between 1500 and 3K RPM, and upto 6K RPM its got much more drive and even very slight throttle adjustments translate really directly to forward momentum without being jerky. The old DVT I always felt I needed to make much more positive efforts to progress quickly - dropping a gear and whacking the throttle wide open, always thinking it was only able to deliver "just enough" to qualify as quick unless you felt like revving it right out, where it absolutely was quick, but that’s not where you spend 90% of your time when riding. Throughout the range permitted during the 1260's break-in (the period of which there is a virtual limiter in play) it feels like the engine is much more eager to spin - it’s a fair bit more lively. As a bit of a side issue, I often had the feeling with my old DVT that the starter motor wasn't well matched to the compression of the old 1200. When you thumbed the starter button it would turn over until it started to get near TDC and begin to stall until a spark lit the charge and fired it into life - which admittedly it did, very reliably. The 1260's lump just spins like a jap four on the starter. Probably just a better spec starter motor and beefier electrics in general to provide the appropriate amps to turn it over more confidently. I know this means nothing to performance but it adds to the overall impression of a much more sorted power-plant.

On the '15 DVT they improved the various throttle maps in the different modes on some of the ECU re-flashes, but I still felt the need to set my "Touring" mode to use the full-power and most aggressive setting. The 1260's un-tweaked "Touring" mode feels even better than that. Loads of drive and a much improved response, yet completely civilised. I won't be tweaking the "Touring" mode but I probably will bump up the engine setting in "Urban" mode, just because.

Handling - Well if they've softened the rake then I can't feel it in the areas where I thought I would. It still tips in easy on the initial turn-in on low speed corners. It all feels so familiar but high speed handling is noticeably more planted. Essentially, they've got this aspect completely spot on. You often read about geometry changes and shudder at the thought of the subtle tweaking having the effect of making the handling quirky or just ruined, but this isn't. It's just another very subtle improvement.

All up it's a whole raft of small changes, as has been reported in many places - maybe with the exception of the engine because to describe it as such would be to downplay it. Some of the differences are more nuanced, but within just the engine department those small differences add up to put a much wider smile on your face than that previous gen. The pure "twist'n'go at any revs" capability, which should be a factor on any litre-plus bike, is back and it's damned good.

I'm also noticing some improvements on fixtures and fittings. After 3 winters on the old DVT I know exactly where the weak points are in terms of corrosion on bolt-heads, etc. There are a few sets of bolts in obvious spots where there has clearly been an up-tick in quality. For example, wheel clamp bolts and those securing the pillion footrests appear to have more substantial finishes rather than just being left plain. We'll have a better idea over the last of these winter weeks but there does appear to have been some consideration that an all-can-do bike needs to be able to do it in all conditions, all year round.

So on reflection - having acquired the 1260S Touring without even test riding it, purely on the back of a couple of press reviews that confirmed that the new bike hasn't been ruined at least - am I happy that I've changed from my perfectly good '15 DVT? Actually, I am, and much more than I thought I would. It is all small changes but collectively I believe that they are more significant than the sum of their parts. For anyone wondering whether to change then it is an obviously better bike, in no small part because of the new engine. The journo's might all be saying that it's just a small update, but I doubt that any of them have lived with the previous bike for nearly 17,000 miles in 2 years and then ridden the '15 DVT and 1260 back-to-back.

I could now have a bit of a conundrum. I have two bikes in my garage, the Multi 1260S and an MT-10SP. The bike I previously took out of the garage reflected my mood or the requirement at the time. The '15 DVT would be the bike I'd take if I was just going to work, doing longer distances and touring, lugging some stuff around, etc, and the MT-10SP for when I just wanted to go out for a slightly more lively experience. I've got a distinct feeling that when the 1260S is broken in then that’s going to change. I don't think it's ever going to be as much of a hooligan as the Yam but the gap is surely going to be a narrower, but then it might just be that I've got "new bike syndrome". Only time will tell.
Click to expand...

Nigel Machin said: ↑

Agree with your findings, had a ride out today, first time 2 up and I stopped to check rear tyre, all was fine but stock suspension setting is too soft and ride height is lower than dvt, I’m 500 miles in now and loving the differences, a few tweaks here and there with the settings and it’ll be perfect
Click to expand...

I can't make a comparison as my 1260 is my first Ducati, and I haven't even got it yet, I'm picking it up Saturday! What I can say however is that one hour on the demo bike was all I needed to get out the wallet!! I have been re living that hour in my head for the last two weeks and I am itching to get on the bike. As a Ducati virgin and someone who has lusted after a Multistrada for some time I can confirm it did not disappoint. I tried the MT10 and love the crossplane motor but I do a fair bit of touring so the Multi was always going to win on that front. One comparison I can make is with fuelling. The injected bikes I have owned (and test ridden) have all had fuelling issues of some sort or another, but I found the 1260 was faultless in that respect. I come from a Yam 1200 Super Tenere which was faultless over 30,000 miles in three years and felt like it would never let me down, but it lacked the grin factor, no such problem with the 1260
I don't know if it's just the romantic in me but owning a Ducati feels a bit like joining an exclusive club. There is somehow a different feeling in owning one...........even if I haven't actually got it yet!!!!

El Toro · Apr 17, 2018

Groundhog said: ↑

I don't know if it's just the romantic in me but owning a Ducati feels a bit like joining an exclusive club. There is somehow a different feeling in owning one...........even if I haven't actually got it yet!!!!
Click to expand...

And welcome to the “buying tat/landfill club”

Rainman · Apr 18, 2018

By the end of today my 1260 will be completely run-in. It's taken me a little while as until last weekend the weather has not been conducive to riding any more than is required by my daily commute, and the mileage I'm covering for my commute has dropped significantly to only 30 miles per day at present, from 50 miles per day in the last year and 100 miles per day in the previous year.

Stay tuned for a separate update tomorrow - there's been a few developments since first starting this thread.

Barryelm · Apr 18, 2018

Rainman said: ↑

Picked up my 1260S Touring in white on Friday morning. Have only done 100 miles but thought I'd share my initial findings, much of which you probably have already have read about,

The display - big improvement, both in terms of readability and also the user interface. I never had a problem with the old screen but the new one is noticeably clearer. The interface is much more representative of a modern bike and not so much an 8-bit games console. Animated sequences on things like gear changes, display options, etc, is a nice touch.

Heated grips - a very noticeable improvement. On Friday it was +3c when I picked up my 1260. Once I got going I actually felt the need to lower the power to medium as my hands started to get a bit clammy inside my Dainese Scout Evo gloves. My hands were toasty, whereas the old DVT when it was approaching 0 degrees C you struggled to be able to tell if they were even on.

Gearbox - The quickshift is a little quirky compared to others I've used. If you leave your toe at the end of the upshift position for any period of time the ECU will see it as another shift and will cut the throttle briefly - data from the load cell isn't being processed after the change has happened, so the system can't tell whether your toe has gone back to where it was before the gear change happened, so timing of the shift sequence is partly down to you. Don't be lazy with your toe when shifting up and it's fine. The throttle cut timing is also hugely generous, resulting in a bit of a lurch during changes with a wider throttle opening. Whether this timing is something that gets better with higher revs we'll find out after the break-in period. Whilst this might sound like a criticism lets not forget that a lot of quick shifters need you to be working the engine above the first 1/3 of the rev range before they will work properly, but the 1260's QS works right off the bottom end at any revs. By comparison, on my MT10SP I tend to only use the QS when getting on the gas in the mid-range because it just doesn't play well below 4K rpm whereas the 1260's works pretty much everywhere. Aside from needing some slightly positive toe pressure there is nothing much to say about the auto-blipper because it is otherwise sublime. It's just effortless downshifts at any revs, exactly as it should be. Very happy with the system and an obvious plus over having nothing previously.

I'm having a small issue with finding neutral when stationary. If I roll to stop I can find neutral with the clutch in and still moving, but once I stop I'm just going 1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-turn-off-engine-N. It's a bit like it's overfilled with oil, and looking at the level on the oil spy-glass it looks like it just might be. I'll report back on this.

Engine - Simply put, this is how the '15 DVT should have been out of the box. Even after a continual release of new ECU code for the '15 DVT the low-down drive had seen some improvement but it's still not a patch on the 1260. The 1260 is just much more flexible even from just below 2K RPM and you will no longer get caught out in the wrong gear. Obviously, don't just grab a fistful at bugger-all revs because it will still feel a bit lumpy, but you don't have to nanny the throttle either - just ride and use the throttle normally and it behaves really well in the region between 1500 and 3K RPM, and upto 6K RPM its got much more drive and even very slight throttle adjustments translate really directly to forward momentum without being jerky. The old DVT I always felt I needed to make much more positive efforts to progress quickly - dropping a gear and whacking the throttle wide open, always thinking it was only able to deliver "just enough" to qualify as quick unless you felt like revving it right out, where it absolutely was quick, but that’s not where you spend 90% of your time when riding. Throughout the range permitted during the 1260's break-in (the period of which there is a virtual limiter in play) it feels like the engine is much more eager to spin - it’s a fair bit more lively. As a bit of a side issue, I often had the feeling with my old DVT that the starter motor wasn't well matched to the compression of the old 1200. When you thumbed the starter button it would turn over until it started to get near TDC and begin to stall until a spark lit the charge and fired it into life - which admittedly it did, very reliably. The 1260's lump just spins like a jap four on the starter. Probably just a better spec starter motor and beefier electrics in general to provide the appropriate amps to turn it over more confidently. I know this means nothing to performance but it adds to the overall impression of a much more sorted power-plant.

On the '15 DVT they improved the various throttle maps in the different modes on some of the ECU re-flashes, but I still felt the need to set my "Touring" mode to use the full-power and most aggressive setting. The 1260's un-tweaked "Touring" mode feels even better than that. Loads of drive and a much improved response, yet completely civilised. I won't be tweaking the "Touring" mode but I probably will bump up the engine setting in "Urban" mode, just because.

Handling - Well if they've softened the rake then I can't feel it in the areas where I thought I would. It still tips in easy on the initial turn-in on low speed corners. It all feels so familiar but high speed handling is noticeably more planted. Essentially, they've got this aspect completely spot on. You often read about geometry changes and shudder at the thought of the subtle tweaking having the effect of making the handling quirky or just ruined, but this isn't. It's just another very subtle improvement.

All up it's a whole raft of small changes, as has been reported in many places - maybe with the exception of the engine because to describe it as such would be to downplay it. Some of the differences are more nuanced, but within just the engine department those small differences add up to put a much wider smile on your face than that previous gen. The pure "twist'n'go at any revs" capability, which should be a factor on any litre-plus bike, is back and it's damned good.

I'm also noticing some improvements on fixtures and fittings. After 3 winters on the old DVT I know exactly where the weak points are in terms of corrosion on bolt-heads, etc. There are a few sets of bolts in obvious spots where there has clearly been an up-tick in quality. For example, wheel clamp bolts and those securing the pillion footrests appear to have more substantial finishes rather than just being left plain. We'll have a better idea over the last of these winter weeks but there does appear to have been some consideration that an all-can-do bike needs to be able to do it in all conditions, all year round.

So on reflection - having acquired the 1260S Touring without even test riding it, purely on the back of a couple of press reviews that confirmed that the new bike hasn't been ruined at least - am I happy that I've changed from my perfectly good '15 DVT? Actually, I am, and much more than I thought I would. It is all small changes but collectively I believe that they are more significant than the sum of their parts. For anyone wondering whether to change then it is an obviously better bike, in no small part because of the new engine. The journo's might all be saying that it's just a small update, but I doubt that any of them have lived with the previous bike for nearly 17,000 miles in 2 years and then ridden the '15 DVT and 1260 back-to-back.

I could now have a bit of a conundrum. I have two bikes in my garage, the Multi 1260S and an MT-10SP. The bike I previously took out of the garage reflected my mood or the requirement at the time. The '15 DVT would be the bike I'd take if I was just going to work, doing longer distances and touring, lugging some stuff around, etc, and the MT-10SP for when I just wanted to go out for a slightly more lively experience. I've got a distinct feeling that when the 1260S is broken in then that’s going to change. I don't think it's ever going to be as much of a hooligan as the Yam but the gap is surely going to be a narrower, but then it might just be that I've got "new bike syndrome". Only time will tell.
Click to expand...

Barryelm · Apr 18, 2018

Rainman said: ↑

By the end of today my 1260 will be completely run-in. It's taken me a little while as until last weekend the weather has not been conducive to riding any more than is required by my daily commute, and the mileage I'm covering for my commute has dropped significantly to only 30 miles per day at present, from 50 miles per day in the last year and 100 miles per day in the previous year.

Stay tuned for a separate update tomorrow - there's been a few developments since first starting this thread.
Click to expand...

I am interested to know what happened about the neutral issue. I have a 2016 DVT which did not have any problem finding neutral. This week I test rode a 1260s and my views reflect yours. However it was impossible to select neutral. I have a weak left hand and holding a clutch in for more than 30 seconds is painful. I was told that this problem corrects itself (newness wearing off and crap like that) and only some bikes have the problem. The test bike was 3 months old and had over 600 miles on the clock. I have placed a deposit on the new bike with a written proviso that I will reject any new bike that will not select neutral with the motor running. As far as I am concerned it is a safety issue besides the extreme discomfort. I cannot keep cutting the motor at traffic lights to find neutral. I would be very interested to hear from anyone about this problem

Boomer · Apr 18, 2018

Barryelm said: ↑

I am interested to know what happened about the neutral issue. I have a 2016 DVT which did not have any problem finding neutral. This week I test rode a 1260s and my views reflect yours. However it was impossible to select neutral. I have a weak left hand and holding a clutch in for more than 30 seconds is painful. I was told that this problem corrects itself (newness wearing off and crap like that) and only some bikes have the problem. The test bike was 3 months old and had over 600 miles on the clock. I have placed a deposit on the new bike with a written proviso that I will reject any new bike that will not select neutral with the motor running. As far as I am concerned it is a safety issue besides the extreme discomfort. I cannot keep cutting the motor at traffic lights to find neutral. I would be very interested to hear from anyone about this problem
Click to expand...

Mine was a little awkward at 1st, now just done 600 miles, booked in for its 1st service next week, and its already much easier to get neutral now
Im sure it will be fine after the service

broke · Apr 18, 2018

Barryelm said: ↑

I am interested to know what happened about the neutral issue. I have a 2016 DVT which did not have any problem finding neutral. This week I test rode a 1260s and my views reflect yours. However it was impossible to select neutral. I have a weak left hand and holding a clutch in for more than 30 seconds is painful. I was told that this problem corrects itself (newness wearing off and crap like that) and only some bikes have the problem. The test bike was 3 months old and had over 600 miles on the clock. I have placed a deposit on the new bike with a written proviso that I will reject any new bike that will not select neutral with the motor running. As far as I am concerned it is a safety issue besides the extreme discomfort. I cannot keep cutting the motor at traffic lights to find neutral. I would be very interested to hear from anyone about this problem
Click to expand...

If you would like to drop it off down here Barryelm, I'll gladly run it in for you as long as you pay for the fuel as well

Woody · Apr 18, 2018

I've done 1800miles on my 1260ST and it pops into neutral easily. It was a bit tricky up until the 1st service as others have said. Brilliant bike: fast, comfy, corners on rails in true Ducati fashion and looks great IMO.

Lord Farquaad · Apr 18, 2018

Barryelm said: ↑

I am interested to know what happened about the neutral issue. I have a 2016 DVT which did not have any problem finding neutral. This week I test rode a 1260s and my views reflect yours. However it was impossible to select neutral. I have a weak left hand and holding a clutch in for more than 30 seconds is painful. I was told that this problem corrects itself (newness wearing off and crap like that) and only some bikes have the problem. The test bike was 3 months old and had over 600 miles on the clock. I have placed a deposit on the new bike with a written proviso that I will reject any new bike that will not select neutral with the motor running. As far as I am concerned it is a safety issue besides the extreme discomfort. I cannot keep cutting the motor at traffic lights to find neutral. I would be very interested to hear from anyone about this problem
Click to expand...

My 17 DVT was awful at first, there were times it wouldn’t select neutral whilst running even! But after the 1st service it was fine and has remained sweet. I was quite worried at first but if I bought a new one with the same characteristic I wouldn’t worry now.

nostatic · Apr 18, 2018

One key can be to find neutral while the bike is still rolling. If you wait until you stop it can be hard to find. I usually will click into N the final few feet while rolling to a stop.

nostatic · Apr 18, 2018

Rainman said: ↑

Stay tuned for a separate update tomorrow - there's been a few developments since first starting this thread.
Click to expand...

I need the popcorn eating emoji. Color me curious.

gc6269 · Apr 19, 2018

I had my 1st ride at the weekend using Giles gear and brake pedals.

The gear lever is set to the fast position and if definitely improves both shift and neutral selection.

It’s not perfect, but much better.

SteveE · Apr 19, 2018

Nigel Machin said: ↑

Finding Neutral gets much easier with a few more miles on the clock, 300 or so on mine and neutral is much much better
Click to expand...

Strangely my 17 PP was brilliant for neutral (and throughout the gears) from the off but now after 4,000 miles it's suddenly got difficult to find and it doesn't go from 2nd to First as smoothly either. Also had my first two false neutrals the other day. Any (constructive) ideas what that all might be down to would be appreciated. Oh the joy of owning a ducati ;- ) my original 2010 multi needed 208 parts renewed in the gearbox within 6 weeks from new. Wouldn't go above 3rd gear. After we got over the factory being in their summmet holidays for a month(!) the dealer rebuilt it and it was perfect after that. I'm hoping this is just a dry/dirty linkage that needs cleaning when I get a chance. Is that possible?

Sotos christou · Apr 19, 2018

SteveE said: ↑

Strangely my 17 PP was brilliant for neutral (and throughout the gears) from the off but now after 4,000 miles it's suddenly got difficult to find and it doesn't go from 2nd to First as smoothly either. Also had my first two false neutrals the other day. Any (constructive) ideas what that all might be down to would be appreciated. Oh the joy of owning a ducati ;- ) my original 2010 multi needed 208 parts renewed in the gearbox within 6 weeks from new. Wouldn't go above 3rd gear. After we got over the factory being in their summmet holidays for a month(!) the dealer rebuilt it and it was perfect after that. I'm hoping this is just a dry/dirty linkage that needs cleaning when I get a chance. Is that possible?
Click to expand...

Try changing the oil believe it or not. I use motility 20w50 fully synthetic

Wealdy · Jul 2, 2018

Rainman said: ↑

Picked up my 1260S Touring in white on Friday morning. Have only done 100 miles but thought I'd share my initial findings, much of which you probably have already have read about,

The display - big improvement, both in terms of readability and also the user interface. I never had a problem with the old screen but the new one is noticeably clearer. The interface is much more representative of a modern bike and not so much an 8-bit games console. Animated sequences on things like gear changes, display options, etc, is a nice touch.

Heated grips - a very noticeable improvement. On Friday it was +3c when I picked up my 1260. Once I got going I actually felt the need to lower the power to medium as my hands started to get a bit clammy inside my Dainese Scout Evo gloves. My hands were toasty, whereas the old DVT when it was approaching 0 degrees C you struggled to be able to tell if they were even on.

Gearbox - The quickshift is a little quirky compared to others I've used. If you leave your toe at the end of the upshift position for any period of time the ECU will see it as another shift and will cut the throttle briefly - data from the load cell isn't being processed after the change has happened, so the system can't tell whether your toe has gone back to where it was before the gear change happened, so timing of the shift sequence is partly down to you. Don't be lazy with your toe when shifting up and it's fine. The throttle cut timing is also hugely generous, resulting in a bit of a lurch during changes with a wider throttle opening. Whether this timing is something that gets better with higher revs we'll find out after the break-in period. Whilst this might sound like a criticism lets not forget that a lot of quick shifters need you to be working the engine above the first 1/3 of the rev range before they will work properly, but the 1260's QS works right off the bottom end at any revs. By comparison, on my MT10SP I tend to only use the QS when getting on the gas in the mid-range because it just doesn't play well below 4K rpm whereas the 1260's works pretty much everywhere. Aside from needing some slightly positive toe pressure there is nothing much to say about the auto-blipper because it is otherwise sublime. It's just effortless downshifts at any revs, exactly as it should be. Very happy with the system and an obvious plus over having nothing previously.

I'm having a small issue with finding neutral when stationary. If I roll to stop I can find neutral with the clutch in and still moving, but once I stop I'm just going 1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1-turn-off-engine-N. It's a bit like it's overfilled with oil, and looking at the level on the oil spy-glass it looks like it just might be. I'll report back on this.

Engine - Simply put, this is how the '15 DVT should have been out of the box. Even after a continual release of new ECU code for the '15 DVT the low-down drive had seen some improvement but it's still not a patch on the 1260. The 1260 is just much more flexible even from just below 2K RPM and you will no longer get caught out in the wrong gear. Obviously, don't just grab a fistful at bugger-all revs because it will still feel a bit lumpy, but you don't have to nanny the throttle either - just ride and use the throttle normally and it behaves really well in the region between 1500 and 3K RPM, and upto 6K RPM its got much more drive and even very slight throttle adjustments translate really directly to forward momentum without being jerky. The old DVT I always felt I needed to make much more positive efforts to progress quickly - dropping a gear and whacking the throttle wide open, always thinking it was only able to deliver "just enough" to qualify as quick unless you felt like revving it right out, where it absolutely was quick, but that’s not where you spend 90% of your time when riding. Throughout the range permitted during the 1260's break-in (the period of which there is a virtual limiter in play) it feels like the engine is much more eager to spin - it’s a fair bit more lively. As a bit of a side issue, I often had the feeling with my old DVT that the starter motor wasn't well matched to the compression of the old 1200. When you thumbed the starter button it would turn over until it started to get near TDC and begin to stall until a spark lit the charge and fired it into life - which admittedly it did, very reliably. The 1260's lump just spins like a jap four on the starter. Probably just a better spec starter motor and beefier electrics in general to provide the appropriate amps to turn it over more confidently. I know this means nothing to performance but it adds to the overall impression of a much more sorted power-plant.

On the '15 DVT they improved the various throttle maps in the different modes on some of the ECU re-flashes, but I still felt the need to set my "Touring" mode to use the full-power and most aggressive setting. The 1260's un-tweaked "Touring" mode feels even better than that. Loads of drive and a much improved response, yet completely civilised. I won't be tweaking the "Touring" mode but I probably will bump up the engine setting in "Urban" mode, just because.

Handling - Well if they've softened the rake then I can't feel it in the areas where I thought I would. It still tips in easy on the initial turn-in on low speed corners. It all feels so familiar but high speed handling is noticeably more planted. Essentially, they've got this aspect completely spot on. You often read about geometry changes and shudder at the thought of the subtle tweaking having the effect of making the handling quirky or just ruined, but this isn't. It's just another very subtle improvement.

All up it's a whole raft of small changes, as has been reported in many places - maybe with the exception of the engine because to describe it as such would be to downplay it. Some of the differences are more nuanced, but within just the engine department those small differences add up to put a much wider smile on your face than that previous gen. The pure "twist'n'go at any revs" capability, which should be a factor on any litre-plus bike, is back and it's damned good.

I'm also noticing some improvements on fixtures and fittings. After 3 winters on the old DVT I know exactly where the weak points are in terms of corrosion on bolt-heads, etc. There are a few sets of bolts in obvious spots where there has clearly been an up-tick in quality. For example, wheel clamp bolts and those securing the pillion footrests appear to have more substantial finishes rather than just being left plain. We'll have a better idea over the last of these winter weeks but there does appear to have been some consideration that an all-can-do bike needs to be able to do it in all conditions, all year round.

So on reflection - having acquired the 1260S Touring without even test riding it, purely on the back of a couple of press reviews that confirmed that the new bike hasn't been ruined at least - am I happy that I've changed from my perfectly good '15 DVT? Actually, I am, and much more than I thought I would. It is all small changes but collectively I believe that they are more significant than the sum of their parts. For anyone wondering whether to change then it is an obviously better bike, in no small part because of the new engine. The journo's might all be saying that it's just a small update, but I doubt that any of them have lived with the previous bike for nearly 17,000 miles in 2 years and then ridden the '15 DVT and 1260 back-to-back.

I could now have a bit of a conundrum. I have two bikes in my garage, the Multi 1260S and an MT-10SP. The bike I previously took out of the garage reflected my mood or the requirement at the time. The '15 DVT would be the bike I'd take if I was just going to work, doing longer distances and touring, lugging some stuff around, etc, and the MT-10SP for when I just wanted to go out for a slightly more lively experience. I've got a distinct feeling that when the 1260S is broken in then that’s going to change. I don't think it's ever going to be as much of a hooligan as the Yam but the gap is surely going to be a narrower, but then it might just be that I've got "new bike syndrome". Only time will tell.
Click to expand...

Hi did you have or know about a quickshifter / Autoblipper for the 1200 dvt model?

DaveM · Oct 12, 2018

This has been a really useful and timely review. Makes my recent post on model choice seem redundant now

I’ve ridden an xdiavel s for the last 2.5 years with this engine and can confirm that it is an absolute belter. Looks like I’d better take a 1260S for a test ride...

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