Just thought I'd share this. Suspension. I know bikes come with it but it's not something I've normally thought too much about, just assuming that the bike has been set up for the average rider on an average road (i.e. me), plus it all seemed so complicated and a bit of dark art. Anyhow, I've had my M1100S since Feb, it was bought second hand in Feb with 14,000 miles. I've since done 4,500 miles and never thought once to look at the suspension, just admired the fact it was all spangly Ohlins stuff. I followed this thread since @comfysofa started it as a) I wanted to understand more about this stuff and b) I wanted to see if it made a difference. Well, I read all the posts, watched some of the videos and watched some Dave Moss stuff on YT. Then I thought to myself, having just watched this I'll just go and check my bikes for static sag. I might as well start there, it's easy enough to do. On checking the Monster I discovered there was absolutely zero static sag, zilch, non whatsoever. Any attempt to lift the rear would simply lift the tyre as well. According to Dave Moss this is . I had to apply 4 complete turns of the pre-load adjuster to get approximately the correct amount of static sag. 4 turns. The previous owner had obviously, for whatever reason increased the pre-load on the spring to the degree there was no static sag at all. You wouldn't have it like that if you were using it as a track bike. I just came back from a quick 15 min ride around the block on roads I regularly use but I had to go no further than 100m up our lane before I noticed the dramatic difference. It's a whole load less bouncy, significantly more comfortable, absorbs the bumps much better, I'm not being bounced off the saddle, holds the road better and mid-corner bumps/uneven road surfaces that I used to avoid I no longer have to. It's a completely different bike. Now to enlist an assistant and fine tune the rear to make sure rider sag is within the correct range for the road, then to start on the front (although that does already have static sag, I checked) then to work on compression and rebound rates. One step at a time but seriously what a difference. How many of you out there, like me, just accept the suspension settings as they are when you get the bike?
Have to admit suspension is something I know nothing about and I've never touched it, perhaps it's time to start. Someone at Ktec had a look some years ago and said it was fine for me, I don't think he had a clue to be honest as he said he wasn't sure what position the headstock adjustment was in. Steve
It must be the season for fixing up suspension. I just bought a used Nitron rear shock which is being serviced and adding a new spring suited to my weight. Once its back I will get it on and set up by a suspension pro together with setting the forks correctly. This might be all I need & a fee of £40 to find out will be worth it. If all is still not perfect (ish), I will be looking to get the revalving/ canisters for the forks. I've spoken to Maxton (they're only a short ride away) and they have great reviews.
I've to say i just jump on the bikes and ride it cowboy style these days,years ago i played with the preload/compression/rebound settings on the fireblades but always ended back up at very near standard setup.
That's exactly what I've always done (although not sure about the riding it cowboy stylee thingy). The only adjustment I did was to increase the preload if I had a pillion (this is back in the 70s/80s so not sophisticated, a twist of the unit under the spring from 3 to 5). Thinking on it now, not sure why I increased preload with the extra weight of a pillion, it was a just a thing my mate told me to do.
Also, I forgot to say that when I rode the bike I had to stop after I got onto the main road to adjust the mirrors, all I could see was sky. Clearly, by releasing the pre-load, the back had been raised, hopefully to be more in line with the front now.
I have to admit to being a bit shocked by how some machines end up being setup. I purchased a low mileage 999 last year that handled like a pig at the beginning..proper wallowing mid corner. I really do encourage everyone to set their bikes up..sometimes the transformation can be properly dramatic! This is the setup for a 900ss, but the sag numbers are roughly standard..you can use them as a baseline guide for all...! Happy corners! Grant ----- OEM Showa Suspension Setup I. Set Preload (a/k/a ride height or sag) before adjusting compression and rebound damping (900SS Showa's: 14 revolutions preload adjustment on forks and ring preload adjustment on rear shock). A. Static/Free Sag: 1. Lift motorbike off the ground, including F and R wheels, so that the suspension is topped out (i.e.: the bike's weight is not compressing the suspension at all; cannot use stands to do this). 2. With motorbike/wheels lifted, for F wheel, measure distance of suspension travel with zip-tie on fork leg; and for R wheel, measure distance from a point on bike to rear axle that is perpendicular to ground. 3. Repeat measurements but now with bike on ground loading suspension. 4. Difference between suspension topped out and bike on ground and loading suspension is free sag: a. Front suspension: 20 -- 30mm free sag. b. Rear suspension: 5 -- 10mm free sag. 5. If free sag is not within above range, may need to change spring rates. B. Rider Sag: 1. Repeat free sag measurements above but this time with rider/gear on bike and with rider (and weight distribution) in normal riding position. 2. Difference between suspension topped out and with rider/gear on bike and loading suspension is static/rider sag (should use about 1/3 of the total suspension available): a. Front suspension: for 120mm of total travel, there should be approximately 30mm (race) -- 40mm (street) rider sag. b. Rear suspension: for 65mm of total travel, there should be approximately 15mm (race) -- 21mm (street) rider sag. C. Adjust preload so that static/rider sag is within proper range. 1. Not enough (symptoms): spring not properly loaded; inefficient. 2. Too much (symptoms): harsh ride; poor traction. II. Adjust forks (900SS Showa: 14 click adjustment for compression and rebound). A. Set preload properly (see above). B. Front rebound damping is located at top of fork; spec is 4 clicks out (counterclockwise) from max (fully screwed in clockwise). 1. Not enough (symptoms): pogo effect during transitions; bike rises too much when flicked; loose and imprecise bike/front; understeers & bike/front turns wide (solution: 2 clicks in). 2. Too much (symptoms): suspension is packing down; bike/front chatters over ripples; front doesn’t ride down backside of bump; harsh ride over bumps; oversteers & bike/front wants to tuck-in in corners; poor front tire grip; tank slap under acceleration (solution: 2 clicks out). C. Front compression damping is located at bottom of fork; spec is 6 clicks out (counterclockwise) from max (fully screwed in clockwise). 1. Not enough (symptoms): fork bottoms out; front dives excessively during braking; front feels vague; bike wallows in transitions (solution: 2 clicks in). 2. Too much (symptoms): chatter at handlebars even when not braking; fork jumps off crest of bump instead of riding down it; harsh ride over bumps; front rides high in corners; understeers & bike/front turns wide (solution: 2 clicks out). III. Adjust shock (900SS Showa: screw adjustment for compression and rebound). A. Set preload properly (see above). B. Rear rebound damping is located at bottom of shock; spec is 1 full turn out (counterclockwise) from max (fully screwed in clockwise). 1. Not enough (symptoms): pogo effect during transitions; bike rises too much when flicked; loose and imprecise bike/rear; bike wallows/weaves over bumps; decreased traction (solution: screw in 2 turns). 2. Too much (symptoms): suspension is packing down; bike/rear chatters over ripples; harsh ride over bumps; slow steering; understeers & bike turns wide (solution: screw out 2 turns). C. Rear compression damping is located at top of shock; spec is 1 full turn out (counterclockwise) from max (fully screwed in clockwise). 1. Not enough (symptoms): shock bottoms out; too much rear squat during acceleration causing front to lose grip/lighten; rear bumps sideways during acceleration out of corners; bike wallows in transitions; understeers & bike turns wide (solution: screw in 2 turns). 2. Too much (symptoms): lack of rear squat during acceleration; harsh ride over bumps, which increases with speed; rear kicks out/skips over medium/large bumps (solution: screw out 2 turns). IV. To quicken steering, move front forks up in the triple claims and/or increase the rear shock's length (if available). V. Remember to record all adjustments and to make changes to suspension (rebound and compression as well as forks and shock) one at a time.
The difference between the first six months of owning my bike, when everything was standard setting, and subsequently is night and day. Makes such a difference setting everything up compared to the out-of-the-box settings. Which reminds me, I have to slacken off the compression damping as it appears no one maintains roads around here any more. (Cue life and death struggle to get the rebound right afterwards)
HI @PaulPhillips - yeah - suspension is something i still "have a stab at" - getting the sag is something ive not got right yet....first of all i need a second person (wife will just get pissy so write her off) and secondly id have to get all my stuff on too - so id feel like a right dick in the garage trying to manhandle the bike with a full set of leathers on.! ive not been back in the garage to do any suspension stuff as ive had a busy week but i plan to be back in the garage saturday - low and behold its gonna be raining..!
Ill definately take you up on that (probably x3 for all 3 of mine...) be nice to go out for a ride (with tools) to make adjustments as we go....
V4S had zero static sag. 5 full turns to get it back to where it should be. It left the factory like that.
I can well believe those small changes would be magnified 10 fold on a track. I don’t do track days, kinda difficult here there only being one track in the country, but the difference that basic thing of giving the bike some static sag has made on the local roads is tremendously noticeable, even on my short ride earlier.
Wow! I just ordered a c-spanner so I can make adjustments properly to get it right. I don’t like using a screwdriver & hammer. Also thinking of buying one of these Motool Slacker V2 Digital Sag Scale https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01N7UQRQW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_wieADb1K7X6HV
