1098 1098 Obd Adventures

Afternoon ladies and gents.

A few days ago I started down the route of trying to get my phone to talk to my 1098, so I could reset TPS / reset service clock after doing it etc. It's been a ball ache to say the least, and it's still not working.

Hoping I'll solve the problem in time, and this will be useful to anyone else trying to do the same.

Looking online it looked easy; buy a few bits form ebay, plug in, download an app and you'll be away.
I went with the following at a total cost of about £24

Fig 1. OBD2 to Fiat 3-pin adapter lead.

Fig 2 - OBD2 to bluetooth adapter.

The first (Fig1) to plug into the bike, an OBD2-to-Fiat 3 pin cable (what online wisdom suggests is the correct connector). And the second (Fig 2) is an OBD2-to-bluetooth adapter.

After rooting around in the loom (my 1098 engine is in a 996, so things aren't where you'd expect), I hit the first problem: The Fiat 3 pin is most definitely not the correct cable:

Fig 3 - (Not my image, but identical to what I experienced) Top; the connector on the 1098, bottom: the Fiat 3-pin connector.

So; the connectors don't mate properly and the pins on the bought cable are far too big to fit in the Ducati connector. Interestingly, the Ducati connector has three pin in the connector, but only two wires running to it. This got me curious and I looked up the wiring for the Fiat 3-pin connector.

From left to right in the above image (Bottom of Fig 3, let's say pin 1,2,3) they are labelled as follows:
FIAT 3-pin wiring (looked up online):
1: K (Brown wire)
2: Gnd (Black wire)
3: L (Red wire)

This didn't mean much to me past the 'Gnd', which was obviously the 0v or ground line. But reading online suggests the OBD2 uses a communication protocol called RS232 (which we use a lot at work). RS232 requires a minimum of three channels to work: Gnd, Tx (transmit) and Rx (receive) lines. Makes sense that the K, and L lines would be the Tx and Rx lines then. So far so good.

Problem is, the Ducati plug only has two cables (The connector is a 'Superseal' type btw. Available from 12vplanet if you want one - I did!). So, as seen in Fig 3, from left to right on the top connector:
Ducati Superseal connector wiring;
1: Wired
2: Wired (Gnd) - (I worked out it was a Gnd line with a multimeter)
3: NOT connected

These should connect (if the bloody Fiat 3-pin would actually fit) like this:
Fiat 3 Pin (*) 1098
1: K (brown) ----------------------- 1: Wired
2: Gnd (black)---------------------- 2: Wired; Gnd
3: L (red)--------------------------- 3: NOT Connected

This is where the problem lies; one of the REQUIRED comms lines isn't connected, so it's never going to work.

Undeterred, I fished a spare superseal kit out of my toolbox and decided to 'modify' the 3-pin end of the Fiat 3-pin cable to make it fit the Ducati's superseal one.
I used a multimeter to 'buzz out' the purchased cable and make a wiring diagram, and then cut the 3-pin fiat connector off. Fitting superseal pins (not the full connector) to the bare wires then allowed any and all combinations to be tested, but I started with the wiring in (*). To be honest I wasn't expecting it to work because of pin 3 not connecting to anything on the bike, but trusted the instructions provided and plugged it in with my fingers crossed...

It didn't work.

I downloaded and tested with a few different apps at this point, hoping it was just a bug or somehting. I tried:
Torque (lite)
OBD Auto Doctor
MotorData OBD

All of the apps successfully connected to the bluetooth adapter, but none of them managed to communicate with the ECU.

I then ate a consolation hobnob and considered the options:

The problem seemed to be with the Ducati not having enough pins for it to work, but they're not idiots and dealerships clearly manage to plug in, so my attention was firmly on the cable (Fig 1), as wrong. After all, it doesn't fit properly, so why should it have worked when I modified it to fit?

SO....
Since the cable has power leads to the battery (how the bluetooth bit is powered), it's possible that the whatever tool Ducati use has the same system and the Gnd that the RS232 protocol need is the -'ve terminal on the battery. This would mean that the two wired connections on the Ducati's superseal connector are the communications lines (Rx/Tx), that the RS232 protocol requires.

Made sense. BUT, pin 2 on the Ducati superseal connector buzzed as connected (with a multimeter) to the battery, meaning it's probably a ground line....

I thought about it; would a communications line be connected to the Gnd (through a circuit, etc) to such a point that it would buzz as connected with a multimeter, but was in fact still a comms line?
I phoned an electrical engineering colleague. He said he wouldn't expect it to buzz, but couldn't rule it out. I spent a few hours worrying how much a fix would cost me if I plugged it in an shorted something. Then I gave it a go anyway.

It still didn't work.

I tried the following:
Fiat 3-pin end (cut off and bodged) 1098
1: K (brown) -------------------------------- 1: Connected
2: Gnd (black) |--------------2: Connected (suspected Gnd)
3 L (red) ----------------------| 3: NOT connected to bike

Then I tried again with the brown and red wires crossed (transmit and receive have to the correct way round for RS232 to work). Then I tried starting the bike to make sure I hadn't shorted anything. All was well.

I was pretty pissed off with the whole thing not working though.

=================CONNECTING THE APPS =======================
Just to be clear, the apps suggest there is a very specific order things must be done in. Which I've adhered to with all the testing done.
1: Connect phone to OBD bluetooth device
2: Open app and select OBD bluetooth device for app to work with
3: turn on ignition and it should connect
=======================================================

Stage 2:
Having vented my frustration with gin, and a re-watch of the 1981 film Das Boot (epic if you've not seen it), I decided to have another go. Research online showed more modern bike like the Panigali connect through a 4-pin connecter that looks like this:

Fig 4 - the Ducati 4 pin connector. (again, not my image, but the connector is identical, so who give a f**k).

I'd noticed this connector on my 1098 wiring loom and decided it was worth a punt, so I ordered the connecting cable:

Fig 5 - The Ducati 4-pin to OBD convertor cable I ordered.

I was full of optimism, convinced it would plug straight in and all would be well.

Again, disappointment. No connection to the ECU with any of the apps.

This brings us up to date. I hope it's useful so far, and if you're wise at all I could use your wisdom with the following questions:

1) Why does the 1098 loom have both a superseal ("Fiat 3-pin") port and a more modern 4-pin Ducati connector. What are they each for? A) The 3-pin is the correct port, and it is meant to have only 2 wires. The 4-pin port is specific to the 'S' version of the engine for data-logging.
2) Does everyone else have only 2 wires on the Superseal connector on the bike's loom? A) Yes, 2 wires is normal.
3) Which connector is the correct one? A) the 3-pin with only 2-wires is the correct port.
You need this adapter for it https://www.lonelec.co.uk/Motorbike...ectors/Guzzi-Ducati-Aprilia-3pin-OBD2-Adaptor
This is also a good BT-adapter. Lonelec also have one https://www.lonelec.co.uk/Car-Diagnostic-Code-Readers/Bluetooth-OBD2-ELM327-BlueScanII
4) What am I doing wrong? Currently totally out of ideas on what to try next!

======== copied from later post for convenience ==========

Okay, a bit of an update.
The cables arrived - Perfect fit Chris, thanks again for the recommendation!

Unfortunately, still no luck. The new Bluetooth adapter (bought an alternate to rule it out as the fault) does have traffic lights for data over bluetooth and to the ECU - quite useful diagnostically. Shows traffic to and from on both sides:
Phone <==> Adaptor <==> ECU
so, it's talking - it's just not understanding.

I've tried 4 apps with it, and none of them work (ScanM5X, Torque (lite), OBD Auto Doctor and MotorData OBD). The last in the list does give a readout as it tries to connect with the following:
[15:51:02 233] Connection established.
[15:51:03 082] Connection to the interface established
[15:51:03 083] Controller: ELM27
[15:51:03 139] Interface type: OBDII to RS232 interpreter
[15:51:03 230] Interface version: ELM27 v1.5
[15:51:03 265] Supply voltage: 13.1V
[15:51:03 289] Establishing connection to the ECU...
[15:51:05 231] ID ECU #1-10 <--> Protocol: Unknown
[15:51:05 239] Connection not established.

So looks like a Protocol issue - but i thought the whole point of the OBD system was that everything is the same, so that seems like a wild goose chase?

Next move was to order a OBD11 --> USB cable and try to plug in the laptop and see if that works. Maybe it's a android issue... will rule it out if nothing else. Cable is in the post - will keep updated.



Mike.

 

Connector was an amazon job. Can confirm it also has the plastic divider between pins 1 and 2. Exactly as this photo (see bottom right of image):

 

Thought has crossed my mind tbh.

The big draw of the to-the-phone system, is that you can keep the phone in your pocket while riding, and log data while riding. HUGE advantage over plugging into a laptop. Ducatidiag does get good reviews by people online though; it's the current fallback position.
Really don't like giving up though. This should be beatable.

 

Thanks for the reply. Would you be meaning this kit? It's just the Fiat adapter looks identical, so I'm hesitant.
Presumably, you think the cables/Bluetooth unit I've got are causing the connection problem? Quality/BT/whatever?

 

Massively appreciate the help Chris, ordered!
Fingers crossed it's plain sailing from here.

 

Yes I do. Already got ScanM5x, Torque (lite), OBD auto doctor and motorData OBD.
Thought it was best to have plenty to test with.

 

Okay, a bit of an update.
The cables arrived - Perfect fit Chris, thanks again for the recommendation!

Unfortunately, still no luck. The new Bluetooth adapter (bought an alternate to rule it out as the fault) does have traffic lights for data over bluetooth and to the ECU - quite useful diagnostically. Shows traffic to and from on both sides:
Phone <==> Adaptor <==> ECU
so, it's talking - it's just not understanding.

I've tried 4 apps with it, and none of them work (ScanM5X, Torque (lite), OBD Auto Doctor and MotorData OBD). The last in the list does give a readout as it tries to connect with the following:
[15:51:02 233] Connection established.
[15:51:03 082] Connection to the interface established
[15:51:03 083] Controller: ELM27
[15:51:03 139] Interface type: OBDII to RS232 interpreter
[15:51:03 230] Interface version: ELM27 v1.5
[15:51:03 265] Supply voltage: 13.1V
[15:51:03 289] Establishing connection to the ECU...
[15:51:05 231] ID ECU #1-10 <--> Protocol: Unknown
[15:51:05 239] Connection not established.

So looks like a Protocol issue - but i thought the whole point of the OBD system was that everything is the same, so that seems like a wild goose chase?

Next move was to order a OBD11 --> USB cable and try to plug in the laptop and see if that works. Maybe it's a android issue... will rule it out if nothing else.

[Will also copy this to original post for anyone seeing this post in the future]

 

More disappointment...

Finally got around to testing the OBDII to usb cable I bought (rule out phone/bluetooth issues), No luck. Connects to whatever's in the box on the cable but can't connect to the ECU for some reason. The result is the same on every platform/device combination. Tried it with OBD Auto Doctor (did look for DucatiDiag, but couldn't find anything that would install on windows 10??)

Now suspect it's something wrong with the bike. Does anyone have any ideas on how to test this?