Watched him at Donnington a few times ,i can assure you ,better tyres or not ,he would kick ass ,in the early days of the screamer 500 ,he would slide it through the corners as the rest were a bit scared as it was a total bitch ,when they swapped to the big bang motor ,which was a bit easier to ride ,he went back to the screamer ,more power ,a total beast ,but he could tame it ,one hell of a rider.
Sorry , Mick Doohan ,i would imagine that they must have given him a much bigger pair of balls to go with his tyres
My eldest son just got back from Jerez he spanners in the WSB paddock,say;s word is M Marquez not fit and Dovi's being mentioned IMHO I think he's the best replacement,think he 's still got something left to show Ducati they were hasty in not keepling him !!!!
Some great stuff on here an its a lot about opinions which makes for a good debate. My only comment re GP racing is that I've attended the last eight at Silverstone. My abiding memories of that are; Watching in awe MM physically wrestle a complicated ride like no other could get near, look like he was about to fall off every corner and be lightening fast - very special talent. And Jorge looking smooth as butter, never looking like he'd fall off ever and be lightening fast. Both the best visible riders if that makes sense as they are all super quick and talented.
It is practically impossible to compare riders from different eras as to who is the best. There are so many differences from machines, to tyres, to points scored, etc, etc. Doohan was great, Rossi was great as were Hailwood and Agostini and many others, but they were the best of their time as Marquez is although whether he will return is a topic between him, his doctors and Honda. Let’s all just enjoy motorcycle racing when it returns at some point this year. Personally, another season like 2020 would not go amiss!
I'll start by saying I wouldn't call myself a fan of Marc, and really not a particular fan of Rossi (although I would never argue that his achievements aren't superb) I think it's really hard to argue Marquez isn't the greatest of all time tbh... Here's why, and feel free to disagree! 1) He rides a bike that's good, but not easy to ride, and he's proven to be the only one really who can win on it, just like Stoner did with Ducati. 2) He's been on the same tyres as everyone else for his whole MotoGP career, Rossi had a period of dual running tyre manufacturers etc 3) The electronics are more regulated now that they have ever been, so no manufacturer has quarter of a second just because they have much better electronics. 4) Marquez has arguably always had at least 3 really strong competitors for a championship, look at the racetimes over the last 4 years, closer than ever. Rossi always had 1 competitor but rarely more than 1 consistently across a season. Biaggi, then Gibernau, the Hayden in a year when tbh Rossi's Yamaha wasn't the best bike they made, and Hayden rode the blooming wheels off the Honda! 5) Marquez is the ONLY rider since Rossi lined up on the grid in 2001 that hasn't been mentally destroyed by Rossi. Biaggi, Gibernau, Melandri, Stoner (Leguna Seca Meltdown), Lorenzo (The Wall) I hope he comes back purely because what he's managed to do is re-invent the sport, he's changed the way they ride, it's elbow down under the bike style that he's developed from watching riders like Stoner, not Rossi. The others have had to adapt, and he pulls everyone forwards because frankly getting beaten by the amount he has on occasion is humbling. I'll just say.... every one of those guys are absolute gods though...
I think its important to note that whilst the special tyres could have helped Rossi (or anyone else who had access to them over the years) its not really fair to penalise them for that in comparisons imo. Its also a possibility that these riders were that fast without the special treatment. The "advantage" from the tyres is not wholly known. For example do you think MM would have been massively faster with special tyres?
Well that is true, of course and that's the point I was sort of eluding to. Once you start diving into special tyres it's a mindfield, I mean in 2006 Rossi would have appreciated some that stopped the massive chatter issues. Since 2015 Marquez would have liked even harder front tyres so the Honda didn't overheat the tyres, I remember Crutchlow saying they could only ever use the Hard compounds, so yeah, It's a whole separate debate and surely why they got rid of it so that the manufacturers have to work to what they can get.
Not going to disagree with anything you say except, Marquez has yet to win a world championship for a different manufacturer. Only two riders in the modern era have done that, Rossi and Stoner and a total of five since there has been a world championship. Geoff Duke, Giacomo Agostini and Eddie Lawson being the other three. If or when MM can achieve that, I’ll reappraise my list of GOATS. I think what Rossi has done for MotoGP is exceptional but Ago is still my favourite of all time. An incredible rider, a great ambassador for motorcycling and a gentleman. Andy
I think I understand your reasoning, as to win championships on different bikes shows that it was not only the bike which enabled the success. On the otherhand, it could be said that rider left one team for another to secure a better bike or management team that would create sucess. An obvious example of this would have been Schumacher with Ferrari & Jean Todt / Ross Brawn
I kind of agree about the winning on multiple bikes now, I was actually really excited about seeing Rossi go to Ducati, because I thought he would do what he did with Yamaha. That said, Stoner was crashing because he was riding over the limit to get results on a bike that was without a doubt getting worse, so perhaps most saw that coming. The yamaha even without Rossi was certainly improving, it wouldn't have had the rider to win the championship but the ideas for improvement did not come from Rossi, at his very first test he had 2 different 'Cross Plane' engines and Chassis that were a significant step forwards. No one can tell me that he went there from a V5 Honda and said "you need to make a cross plane" anyway, that's getting very off topic... When do you think we will know about Marquez? I think if we don't know much more about his future or comeback date by the first race the media rumours will surely go into overdrive. Do you think Dovi will be called in? I somehow remember him having a really sour ending to the Honda relationship?
If Dovi goes to Honda does that say that Honda believe in him and that they believe that Ducati are doing the usual and blaming the rider and not the bike? If Dovi goes back to being in the podium almost every race and winning many, does it say that the Ducati GP20 was a big step backwards?
good question... we will see I think. Ducati claim to have a 'totally new bike' but looking at the blurred shot they used in the press event preview it looks pretty similar! I'd be surprised if they have done much too it.
I think MM has released just enough information and that is ‘I’m in training’. I’m also pretty sure that his return is not at the forefront of the other riders minds although I’m sure mind games are in play. Yamaha have to use last year’s bike, Suzuki have to break in a new team manager and there is no testing. KTM will be on a crest of a wave and Aprilia will be, well, Aprilia. The Sky Sports interview with Dovi would seem to rule out a stand in ride under any circumstances. One thing for sure, to my knowledge, MM is neither an alien nor a superman and the complications with his arm and shoulder is going to take measured time to fully recover which puts me in the ‘unlikely to make a competitive return for the first race’ camp. More than happy to be proved wrong and I’ll put my hands up if I am. Andy
The kid has got nothing to prove by coming back not fully recovered, I’m sure everybody advising him will try to convince him to only come back once he’s 100% fixed and healed or as close as humanly possible considering his injuries. His advisers would surely try to convince him that even if he missed this coming race season and was properly fixed, he would still have many many years of racing ahead of him to add even more titles and race wins. I hope for him and the watching world he fully recovers and is able to display his amazing talent to everybody once again irrespective if you like him or not. It would be awful to see him forced to quit because of injuries as in the case of any sports star or athlete.
