Now that I have your attention, I would like to ask folks for opinions on this criminal phenomena, and even better, for their suggestions on ways to avoid getting caught up in this. It concerns our roads, and has nothing to do with candid photography :smile: The BBC article explains: Crash for cash has been with us for some time, of course, but this new one seems very sneaky and has the potential to cause a lot of chaos. Thoughts?
What is "flashed the lights to let them out" supposed to mean? As the article itself states and the Highway Code makes clear, there is no such thing. Anyone who, after a collision, relies on claiming to have been "given permission" to proceed by someone else flashing them is on a certain loser. More to the point, there may be other vehicles around such as a motorbike going along the major road who expects to have right of way, has not given permission for anything, has not seen the "flasher", and is endangered by the vehicle coming out of the side turning when it ought to give way. I've been knocked off bikes for this very reason more than once. My sympathy for the alleged victims is rather limited.
Just buy an Audi cause no fucker lets you out and if they did ever flash to let me out I'd be highly suspicious. I was behind a woman in a Nissan Note (National trust and Christian fish sticker job) the other day and as she was traveling down the road she was stopping to let any waiting to pull out! Between my rages of anger and a few pomps on the horn of distaste I could not help notice that every person she had so kindly stopped for was pulling out. I actually thought to myself at the time what are these bell ends doing, what's to stop her suddenly speeding up then wacking a claim in. I guess in her lovely Christian God fearing deluded head she must have though she was gaining heaven tokens by being such a thoughtful motorist.
It's not the only scam out there - Seems there are groups / gangs of people doing this, the braking in front for no reason thing as well as a multitude of other insurance rip offs. My view is the government should clamp down on the accident claim companies - Daytime TV is full of these parasite companies advertising. They should also give heavier sentances for these gangs when they are caught... Also, why are they mainly of asian origin? - The gangs I mean, not the accident claim companies?...
It's an informal arrangement that one sees on the roads these days. Compare this to the situation where there are road works, closing one or more lanes,on m-ways and dual carriageways - sometimes there is a temporary road sign instructing drivers to "filter in turn". Flashing is an informal arrangement between drivers where the one with the right of way wishes, for some reason, to allow the driver giving way to proceed. Legal or not, it happens and when it does happen, convention dictates the drivers' next actions. I hope that clarifies the matter but I am happy to explain further if required. Agreed. There's no legal foot to stand upon here. However, it cannot have escaped your notice that there are many informal/illegal things going on on today's roads. The everyday expectation of a driver is that when flashed at, say, a junction, the driver with right-of-way is indicating his intention to allow the other driver out of said junction. Compare this to indicators being used to indicate intentions - as outlined in the highway code. A lost art it seems on today's roads. Safety concerns aside, for the moment. Absolutely. No situation, whether legal or "informal" means that normal care and safety considerations should be sacrificed. This is because you never proceed, when driving or biking, when permission is given to you by a driver with the right-of-way, right? Do you ever get angry motorists behind you, having seen that you were "flashed" to proceed, coming up to you and giving you a mouthful? The point of my post was not to express outrage at this, let's face it, vile and nasty activity on the part of criminals - no, I would like to know what people will do when they are flashed to proceed by another driver. Ignore or carry on?
The favourite one up here is to simply bang on the brakes for no reason, after first ensuring your brake light bulbs have been removed. Seriously, the number of cars driving around with no brake lights is simply astounding. I couldn't mention which communities appear to be mostly responsible though. 2 weeks ago, my company van nearly fell foul of this and last Saturday it was my girlfriend and I on the ducati which nearly copped for it. Seemingly, nothing anyone can do about it. Had it been a white male driver he would have been pulled from the car via the front air vent but alas, I am afraid of being accused of something which I am not and don't fancy a stop at her majesty's.
sad to read - I know we as bikers we are more 'wary' already but next thing we 100% won't believe car driver's intentions when they indicate. As an overview this could be just another step when it comes to eroding trust in each other, a trust that is on a downward spiral it seems.
Never believe car drivers' intentions when they indicate, or flash headlamps. Often they change their minds mid-manoeuvre, or have left the flasher on by mistake, or indicate left when they meant right, or the flash is aimed at somebody else not you. As an old dog I've seen them all, so rarely get caught out nowadays. Never assume they have seen you in their mirror, even when you have been right behind them for miles. And never assume they have noticed you approaching, even when they have looked straight at you.
thanks Pete, but I have got this by now believe me - was attempting to speak for everyone in a generalisation, possibly foolishly but I don't believe even you 100% do not trust indications given yet
Whether there is space for you to move ahead safely or not is a matter for your judgement of the facts, given the speed and position of all the vehicles on the road. I try to be pretty determined and purposeful about moving forward whenever there is space, especially on a bike. But people flashing headlamps are more or less irrelevant - except as a warning.
Good point. I'm generalising too. Indications are part of the information which you take into account and process as you ride along. Most cars do actually do what they are indicating. My point is there is a percentage who do not, and the next car you see might be one of them.
it is nice to be let out of a junction , but you can not rely on the prospective of another car driver to decide if it is safe for you to pull out ,I was always told that you can only take direction from a policeman and no one else
I wasn't aware of this worrying new development on the "cash for crash" scam. Thanks for flagging it up. I've always been a bit wary of reacting to drivers who flash their headlights though. Many drivers are impatient in the extreme, and don't seem to understand that, despite their flash, it is still necessary to check the rest of the traffic before responding. By the time you've done that, many of them have begun to get annoyed at your delayed reaction, and will often respond by suddenly accelerating forward, probably muttering some road rage at you in the process. On the other hand, courteous flashing to allow a smoother flow of traffic is a practice which I find quite heartwarming, and I do it myself whenever an appropriate occaision arises. It just makes the world a nicer place. There are so many things that are despicable about this worrying new practice. It both saddens me and makes my blood boil. As a result, if I should ever become a victim of such behaviour I would be very inclined, despite being anything but a violent person, to pay these people a visit and make sure that they weren't capable of repeating their nasty tricks for quite some time ...which is in itself a sad thing to say, but there it is. If you live by the sword, etc....
OK. So if a driver is stopped still, flashing to let you in or out, whichever, you do - what? What do you do when the other driver flashes, sounds his horn and starts gesticulating - as in," I am letting you out, damn you, now come out!"? I assume you wait for the storm (and the raging driver) to pass. I recently refused a chap's "kind offer" to cross in front of him to enter a side junction. His body language was what I associate with someone irritated. Whilst I am fine with "irritated", I am less happy with a physical confrontation (I either get beat up, or lose my job as a result of an ABH charge - aka defending myself.
I'm sure other people who live in and around the South West will agree with me on this one - but the "stopping and flashing" thing is the accepted norm around here. It drives me mad - I'm waiting to turn right, I can see a big enough gap to do so behind the car that is approaching from the other direction, I'm all set to pass behind him, and suddenly he brakes and flashes his lights ( but never actually stops moving. All he has done is now close up the gap behind him that I WAS going to pass through, as other vehicles catch up. Or it's the last car in a queue of vehicles that does it - all he had to do was just keep going and I would have passed safely behind him. I will NOT cross in front of drivers who do this - mainly because of the reasons stated by various people above : ie if they drive into the left side of my vehicle as I pass in front of them it is MY fault according to the law. The other variation is stopping to let people out of side-roads for no apparent reason and without warning. Same deal, just bunches up the traffic behind them. Yes, it may have made it fractionally easier for the person pulling out, but it has made it harder for everyone behind. The thing that I really notice about all this though, is how incredibly annoyed drivers get when I DON'T do what they want you to do ( ie put myself in danger by crossing illegally in front of their, still moving, vehicle ) and the older they are, the more annoyed they seem to get, strangely. Here's a tip for car drivers in Devon and Cornwall - concentrate on what YOU are doing, and leave ME to worry about what I'm doing... Rant over...
I agree ^ particularly with last sentence. I get 'after you' flashed far more on bikes than in cars but sometimes due to confidence or because bike not warmed up or because negotiation of action fraught with other hazards I am more likely to decline. Often 'flasher' is expecting an instantaneous action to fit in with request (as you explained) and more likely to end in tears.
The other thing that car drivers do around here - and excuse me for going off topic a bit - is suddenly notice that there is a bike behind them, usually because it's the first time they have looked in their mirror for about five miles, and immediately dive into the gutter - spraying grit and gravel all over the bike behind them. Doesn't matter if it's safe to pass or not - double white lines, blind bends, make no difference - then they get all upset because you haven't gone past. Excuse me, Mr myopic car driver, I've been behind you for the last five minutes : if I wanted to go past I would have done so already. Oh, and by the way, thanks for all the stone-chips in my screen and paintwork ! Oooooo... It makes me cross !
I agree with you there - The amount of muppet drivers that do this really grinds my gears... Some people are so dim - They also do it on motorways when they realise that you are there after about 10 miles...
We have a new A3 Black edition and I can honestly say this is the worst car I have ever had for not being let out, I seem to wait for ages, whilst the selfish dickheads refuse to make any eye contact, In contrast the Cooper S we had before people used go out of their way to let me out.
