1299 Want To Go From 1098r To 1199/1299 But Worried Re Handling. Peeps Experiences?

1199 is far more flickable than thw 1098 series bikes. It changes direction quicker, and takes less effort to turn. However once in the corner i find the 1199 not as stable.

 

and thats the trade off according to most I have spoken to. Making the R turn is where the cost and effort comes in, stability is inbuilt. With the 1199, steering is effortless but stability poorly lacking.

 

handling wont be your concern it'll be the lack of mid range compared to the 1098R id guess

 

Some of the negative things that are said about the 1199 in the press just dont add based on my experience of the 1199s. I think in part they come from the bike needing more time to get used to it.

Too stiff? - I can tell you a little dit that might explain where this comes from. The bike doesn't really work as well in the softer rain or sport modes and you have to take it by the scruff a bit; it's a race bike after all. I almost always ride in race mode with the stiffer settings for this reason (If it's raining really bad then I go down to sport mode which is sufficient). When it's rode fairly hard everything works like a dream, no dramas. At the Isle of Man TT course last year I got onto the middle part of the course (I think its the sections before and after Quarry Bends?) through the trees which is very bumpy and I honestly felt like I had broken something or got a puncture. I pulled over and there was nothing wrong that I could see so I carried on at a slower pace until I got into the towns and up onto the mountain and everything was great again. Next time around at that section it did it again and I realised it was probably suspension related so switched down to Sport mode and gave it beans. It soaked all the bumps up no problem and felt good again. After the section I switched back to race mode and went on my merry way around the town and mountain. So the point being if you are on a standard 1199 and the suspension is set up for its optimum stiffness similar to race mode on the S then it's a friggin nightmare on a very bumpy road!! In nearly twelve months and 5000 miles on Panigales I've honestly not experienced the problem anywhere else other than that section of the IOM but perhaps the people who review the bikes on the roads have their favourite bumpy road to test these things?? I wonder if the new suspension on the 1299 would help with this or if the event driven nature would not pay attention???

The feel from the bike is stunning and the flexibility to do whatever you want with the chassis makes my old R1 feel another ten years older and 50kg heavier than it is, that said it is very sensitive to inputs and takes a few hours for it to feel natural. One big difference between the Panigale and the R1 and perhaps the 1x98 that I've not ridden properly, but certainly the 749 I went out on, is that you can turn deep into corners on the brakes. My R1 will not turn at all until you've released the brakes and the 749 felt very similar.
The Panigale is not as confidence inducing as say the Fireblade or Daytona 675 as you can always feel the massive grunt of the engine is there ready to do it's thing. Also it's very sensitive to riding position so not so stable in the corners; I found that it took me a fair bit of time to work out how best to ride it because it's so narrow and there's loads of space to move around so to start with I was getting myself into some odd positions that didn't really work. Other bikes I've been on have been wider and only really had one obvious position with your legs around the tank or hooked off of it in the corners whereas the Panigale takes a bit more time to suss out what works best. I experimented a bit last year with not moving off the bike so much in the corners after some instructors had commented on trackdayriders forum about the bike being able to lean as much as necessary anyhow ( I didn't agree but always like to try and see what people are getting at), but it didn't work for me at all and I had a couple of 'moments'. I went back to my gangly monkey hanging off and was immediately able to make the bike do what I wanted.

Some long rambling there but I hope it is useful!

 

If its like the skyhook multi (have no idea) that can be set to behave by mode. If you wanted, you could have all modes with exactly the same settings. So of you want firm you up them all

 

The S has lighter wheels than the base and comes with ABS - I think its an extra on the base model. And you get all the gold bling and don't have to get your fingers dirty to adjust the suspension.

 

I have no complaints about the handling on my R, speed of turn or stability. I have never ridden a 1098 but certainly I cannot complain at all about the Panigale handling. I only ride on track.

 

Mattb, there is currently a 2012 1199 for sale at Snells, with just those additions to it.

Used Sales 1

 

Properly put together bike that too

 

I find the handling fine on my 1199s, maybe the test riders were on stock settings on the suspension which won't help at all.
Mind you I have now got an 848 evo to play with too, the bars are lower and the forks closer together and I find that ride position more preferable to the wider stance of the 1199.

 

What fascinating reading. I speak as one with far less experience than the earlier contributors and much less skilful a rider too. I have ridden a 675R for a thousand miles on the road and it was much better at tightening the line mid bend than the 1199S in Sport mode, but it is much less potent a ride. I could wring the Triumph's neck easily, even with my lesser skills, than I can my Panigale. One of the features of the 1199 engine over the 1198 engine is the top end pull. Where the 1198 is endowed with early torque which will taper off at the top end, the newer engine design is the opposite. I gather that the enlarged version out now, the 1299, goes back to having early grunt but also keeps the top end too. I have not tried one and doubt I shall bother, since the 1199 is as much as my skills can cope with. The chassis seems a bit woodern until you look at your velocity, invariably well above what you think it is. At very high speeds, the bike is slightly flighty but at licence retaining ones it is rock solid. I think it is a bike you got to put effort and patience into learning to get it to do what you want.... I am still learning it after nearly 8000 miles. The comment about moving about on the bike is most salient, as I have found that even sticking your knee out into the inside of a bend makes the bike turn much more easily. I am 58 , a bit creaky but not particularly heavy ( 13 stoneish ) and don't have trouble from riding a full day. The tank is so small that you get off to fill up often enough to stretch out and top up on coffee before arthritis sets in. It is a bike one can love, have a love affair with. It is the foibles which make it so characterful, much like the best sort of persons in life to get attached to.

 

A cheap mod well worth considering, you can do it one of two ways, either smaller front sprocket or larger back sprocket, I opted for the latter as I was changing the whole rear flange kit anyway, I went from stock 39 teeth to 43 on the rear it lifts in 3rd and in 4th gear just on the throttle, 4th gear lift is around 120-130mph now that is grunt

 

I've had a 1098S, then 1199S and now have a 1199R.

Personally, I just couldn't get on with the 1098S, it felt like a barge compared to the 1199. It's true the 1199 is less stable coming out of corners and long sweepers. I've found the 1199 much better at changing direction, entering corners and mid corner.

 

^^^^ which seems to be backed up by almost every review I have ever read

 

The 99's are a little lighter than the 98's, but with a bike properly setup you shouldn't notice the difference too much. I use a Panigale on the road and a 1098 as a track bike recently and didn't find it too difficult to use. I had some help with the suspension setup and this only improved things with the 98 further.

RWC has some good points to make and gelled well at Jerez on his 99.

 

Never had any issues at all with my 1199 Tricolore s , ride in Race mode most of the time ,lots of twistys where i live and i give it the beans every oppotunity i get , Usually switch to Sport mode in Town calms the Throttle response down a little as race mode in town can be quite snatchy , i have to say that after 3 years riding the bike hard you really get to know the bike well and i wouldnt want to be on anything else right now, will probably keep the bike for a few more years yet as i just love everything about it

 

I prev had a 1098 and now have a 1199S. The 1098 felt heavy and slow to turn compared to the 1199. It had more mid-range torque, but was in my opinion harder to ride. The 1199 actually feels like it has less power to me, but that's fine as far as I'm concerned and I prefer it to the 1098 on both the road and track.

Hope this helps.

 

To your original comment & question - imagining that the bike is very stiff, hates a bumpy road, easily gets out of shape and gives the rider little "feel". I haven't ridden a 1x98 but I ride a 2010 S1000RR and have just bought a 2012 1199S. Both are track only. For me & what I use it for, the 1199S is a miles better bike. Stiff, no. Communicative, extremely. Out of shape? No, not at all, small controlled wheelies, a bit, yes. Little feel? Never. This bike has the best front end and brakes I have ever used. Race mode, EBC set to 2, it's fantastic. There's stuff I can do on this which is way more granular than the S1000RR for example. I could change direction by a gentle press of the knee into the tank, so if I'm missing the apex and need to bring it back while leant over, just knee couple of mm into the tank and it's right on the apex. Amazing, the level of feel, of granularity and sensitivity of control. Overall, a lovely machine that's got under my skin. So lovely I'm after a 1299 and selling my BM! Just needed a touch more power over the 1199.