I have oap kit on my 999. Higher clipons fitted. On the shelf I have footrest lowering plates on standby. Got a few more seasons before they're reqired though.
Would be interested to see some statistics but with the amount of VFR's & touring Beemers I see I struggle with the statement that "that section of the market continues to be a very small section." :Bookworm:
Good point. Having bought two new Ducatis in the past four years, I may not buy any more unless the factory launch a zimmer model.
I construe that as meaning Ducati have studied that sector but concluded they can't feasibly compete with BMW, and that a new Ducati sport-tourer would mainly cannibalise sales from the Multistrada. So they don't want to risk resources developing a probably unsuccessful model.
I can understand how Ducati is thinking these days. There was a streetfighter trend - lopping off fairings and fitting straight bars, so they made the Streetfighter. There was a supermotard trend, so they made the Hyper. There is a cruiser trend, so they made the Diavel - Ducati's take on a cruiser. But then you look at the Monster, which has been hugely successful for Ducati. What was the Monster trend? I don't think there was one. It was just their brainchild, something they wanted to do. It didn't really fit into any category. Could they have been sure that there would be a huge market for it? I doubt that very much. It was more "suck it and see". And what of the Multistrada? It was their idea to make a "go anywhere bike" - a sportsbike with long-travel suspension and 17" wheels. That wasn't a trend either. But once again, it has been hugely successful. My personal view is that the original MS was cooler than the current one, apart from the grim front fairing. But it is evolving into a sort of "Adventure bike" - fitting back into a category. So I just don't believe that you can focus-group all these things. The biggest successes are things that consumers haven't even thought of. These are the most radical and trend-setting. Nike doesn't believe in consumers knowing what they want. They just chuck out a load of shoes and see which ones take off. The ones that do, they make. The ones that don't, they can. Obviously a new bike is a bit more complicated than a pair of trainers, but then at Ducati, they can use an awful lot of stuff they already have with a few tweaks. It's not as if they need a new engine to produce a sports-tourer. Perhaps that's the problem. They are thinking "sports-tourer" and not liking the "category" when what some of us want is just a comfier, less-edgy sportsbike that harks back to some of the Ducati heritage. It's just that it has to look amazing, then it will sell.
Good point. Focus groups result in products which are much the same as the herd of competitors make. If Ducati had used focus groups in the 1970s they would have been making inline fours, since that was apparently what the market wanted. Instead they got a brilliant designer and let him design what he wanted, namely Taglioni's 90 degree vees. Trouble is, some designers capture the zeitgeist, some don't.
The Wikipedia article on Galluzzi's Monster is interesting. Pretty much tells you why it was successful and that the management took a lot of convincing to make it. No surprise there, then.
Really? I think there were a whole bunch of naked bikes on the market when Ducati got round to launching the Monster. Suzuki's Bandit was launched 4 years previously and the Monster was, in my opinion, their "prettier" version. It was also marketed in the same way as Harleys were by telling people they could customise them to make them individual and unique. Another piece of nifty marketing way before people got their knickers in a twist over the Scrambler hype. Again this was Ducati's take on another marque's model. The BMW 1100GS was launched 10 years before the original Multi was. Again nifty marketing telling the public that this was a "do anything, go anywhere" bike was the master stroke. Ducati have been very clever in taking an existing style and making it even sexier through good design. They've been even cleverer with their marketing to make it seem that they've created new market sectors. Coca Cola anyone?
I think that is the best route Keith - adapt the bike you like the look of and Voila. Studied a few 748's with similar on and headlamp fairing clearance is the only factor - when parked up no-one even notices the higher bars unless scrutinizing.
I got the bars within a few months of getting the bike Chris, dedicated 999 kit from cyclecat, very trick, adjustable, but they can interfere with the fairing. In town if Im using a lot of steering lock I have to ride with my hands further out to to the bar ends or my gloves can catch the fairing, but I move my hands out automatically now.
I agree with you. One of my brothers has a 1200VFR. He went from an ST to the VFR. There were no new ST's. When you sit on a VFR the position is not dissimilar to an ST. I see lots of VFR's about. I don't buy this argument that it's a small/dead market. That is based on the past. It's most likely based on dwindling sales of an ageing model in the last decade, combined with focus groups. Is a focus group going to be able to look into the future and perceive "what could appeal to the populous?" Asking a focus group is like driving a car by just looking through the rear view mirror. Not much good if you want to go forwards. You need vision. To quote Pablo Picasso not just once but twice: “Anything new, anything worth doing, can't be recognized.” "Others have seen what is and asked why. I have seen what could be and asked why not. ” I have looked at Multistrada and ridden them. I don't want to sit up that much yet. I certainly don't want to spoil my ride by taking that much luggage weight. I have long legs but I still find them high. Why do I need that much suspension travel? I have looked at scramblers and ridden them. They are too small for me and they're not designed for great distances. Great run around though, fun to ride. Great concept. I get off my Panigale, which I love, and get on my 15 year old ST and I still find it's a great bike to ride. Not the prettiest but that could be fixed. Then again I wouldn't call a Multistrada pretty. So I have to ask how difficult would it be for Ducati to put a faring or even a small top fairing on a Monster and call it an ST? If I could buy a new ST I would.
Likewise. I've had a 1200 Multi for five years now and, whilst it is a great bike (quality issues notwithstanding), I still love getting back on my ST4s and revelling in the handling and the delicacy and precision of the fuelling. I'm 58, have been riding Ducatis since 1983, writing about them since 1998 and, given the demographic of motorcycling, surely can't be in a tiny minority with a preference for sports tourers, can I? I think that there's a huge dose of confirmation bias here with Ducati: "We don't make a sports tourer and you're the hundredth person we've told today that there's no call for them". If they made one that was technically, ergonmically and aesthetically at the leading edge, I'd bet that they'd sell like the proverbial. As it is, I'm quite possibly off to KTM in the spring.
You know what I think the Ducati USP is? Style. It's not outright performance or even racing pedigree - which plenty of manufacturers could lay claim to. It's style. Riding one makes you stylish. It's a quality which is hard to define, but is bound up in aesthetics and to some extent exclusivity. I am also an Alfa owner. At one time I owned an Alfa GT Junior from 1972 - which was already a rust bucket when I bought it as my only car in 1986 for £600. It had oodles of style. The instruments were nice round clocks in sunken cowls. It had other separate round gauges for "Acqua", "Benzina" and "Oglio". The bodywork was incredibly rounded so that the doors were arcs, not straight-sided. There was no handle on the boot to spoil the lines, it was hidden in the recess in the driver's door and only accessible if the door was open... (took me some weeks to find it). In 2000 I bought the Alfa 156 SW that I still have. It has the same rounded bodywork, the same separate analogue gauges, the same deep cowls. The rear hatch has no handle - you operate it with either a remote key of a handle by the driver's seat. The door handles are retro chrome items. The rear door handles are almost invisible . Alfa drew massively on their old styling cues to produce a car with loads of style that was still modern. It's not the fastest, or the best handling, or the most economical. But it is massively stylish and still looks good 15 years later. It's not a sports car, it's a small estate for people with not much to lug around who want a sporty estate (and not a 4x4...). That is what I want from a Ducati. Not an out and out sportsbike, but a comfy-ish bike with oodles of style. That means curves, design cues that hark back to their heritage, no beaks, no pointy bits, no bitty bits. I'd like analogue clocks (or similar to the big analogue tacho on the 999) not the grim, hideous, grey LCD displays of all bikes these days. Or even a colour one. I don't want to be reminded of a spaceship or a computer. I want a bike that goes against the grain, not one of a herd. They can bring out all the Scramblers (could be any brand), Multistradas or whatever that they like. For me they have not made the bike I expect them to make. And they have been parroting for years that there is no market for such a bike. I think that's bullshit.
Two questions I would be interested in hearing the answers to :- What percentage of Multistrada owners who bought them solely for touring have found them uncomfortable/unfit for purpose and have sold them as a result? Out of the many Multistrada owners how many previously owned an ST and regretted changing?
Dear ducati dealer do you have a sports tourer i can buy today please. "You are the 5th person in this morning, asking that question. I tell you there is no market for it"
To be honest, having owned and ridden an ST4s for nearly nine years now, I don't class it as a sports tourer, I class it as a comfortable sports bike. It handles like a sports bike. It stops like a sports bike and it goes like a sports bike. Following the duck hypothesis... Anyway, I think it is a case of Ducati throwing in the towel. As pointed out, there was nothing wrong with anything that Ducati did for the ST, except the styling, but it is the styling which sells most Ducati's, not capabaility. If it was, then they never would have sold a 600 Monster. The original styling of the ST series wasn't bad, but from some angles it can look like a whistling cyclops — that's not good for a premium motorcycle. But hey, it can happen to the best of them. Ever seen a Bimota Mantra? I reckon that if Ducati took the Monster 12 engine, frame and running gear, put a decent fairing on it and a subframe that could carry luggage and a pillion and it would sell. As long as it looked like a stablemate of a Panigale, not the whistling offspring of a minor Greek god pairing. And yes, as pointed out. It was Kawasaki who started the naked revolution with the Zephyr line in 88. An idea that was stolen by Suzuki in 89 (Bandit), and not executed by Ducati until 93.
An enterprsiing fairing manufacturer could design and market a bolt on fairing for the monster. Choice of 821 1200 and R bikes to stick it on.
