Personally I dont think I would be quick to wear hi viz and it shouldn't be necessary in a perfect world if we all looked out for each other. But when I'm driving a rider with hi viz makes me more aware than the dressed all in black rider as it attracts my attention. Cyclists are the worst especially young males. As I pointed out to my son when taking him to school and one of his school mates just came out of nowhere looking away from me. I was driving slowly but many others were not and it was raining. Pedestrians are no different here they just walk out in front of you. The more hi viz you wear when riding should indicate that you are seen and avoided and should lower bike accidents or go against the car driver who hits you off. Though we also know that some drivers don't commit to what they do and panic and stop so you could argue does hi viz make any difference?
The reason I'm so against hi-viz is that so many people seem to think it's an acceptable replacement for good traffic awareness. Like risk-compensation they think it automatically follows that they will be seen if they wear hi-viz (and unfortunately many governments think the same way), and it just ain't so. If you get knocked off your bike while riding with headlamps blazing, the person that hit you didn't fail to see you, they simply weren't looking. And no amount of hi-viz would have altered the outcome.
Its not a perfect world out there. People are driving around peering through a 2" slot of demisted windscreen plugging in their phone/sat nav, texting their mate, stopping the dog from jumping through onto the front seat, putting on their seatbelt - if you expect a motorcycle, basically a big bicycle to stand out through all this then expect on... Yes, I would like to rock up all black leather & boots like Marlon Brando - but at the same time you Don't Stand Out. Its not a racetrack, you are sharing the road with some big heavy vehicles which will bop you off your bike then squash you, the driver may not even notice, think he's missed a gear or the cd's jumped all cosy in their heated seat with some tunes playing? If it gets me seen for half-a-second on somebody's peripheral vision it may make the difference between them hitting the brake or the accelerator, them pissing & whinging about having a dent in their car wing & you having to spend the rest of your day in hospital getting your leg looked about & fretting about all the bits of fairing & red paint all down the road. :frown: Yes - they should see you. The reality is there are a some shocking drivers out there who DONT.
I agree with you Fig. Hi viz wearing should enable others to see you but I also think that you have to still accept responsibility for your actions too. You can't say just because you are wearing hi viz you should have seen me, you may also have been in a blind spot where you were not visible. Eg behind a large vehicle and you just popped out from behind it at the last moment. Hi viz should hopefully give you that few seconds of getting away with it.
In Suffolk, treat pedestrians as cyclists....give them a wide berth.............but the car driving standard is abominable.....even with headlights on and hi-viz on a bright red bike, it makes no difference at all, they still cause emergency situations. If I go on a run, I can guarantee that within the first five to ten miles, I will have had to have reacted to some tw*t at least four times. Never worn Hi-Viz other than my novice jacket on the track, which I got rid of quite quickly...... I think we as riders have a responsibility to be aware of what is going on as much as the other road users, if not more aware. AL
Fig - a headlamp is a headlamp is a headlamp. Could be a car, lorry, bike, anything? At night in traffic one will blend into another, there are not many hi-viz striped cars out there. :wink: Im not for one second thinking it will make me Immortal, or immune to injury? My only interest is for a little visibility & awareness so I can ride my bike & keep on riding it? The French thing folded because there was a massive outcry against it - dont blame people for it TBH? Nobody likes change, I wear mine because I want to, because I know on a day-to-day basis it DOES make people stand out & keeps blood off my forklift. :biggrin:
Unfortunately for every myopic driver there is an equally inattentive rider. It's common for bikers to blame car drivers for virtually every accident stat relating to bikes, but the truth doesn't bear that out. More often than not it's the bikers putting themselves in harm's way without any interference from car drivers. The fact they get hit by a car is often the effect, not the cause. Advanced riding courses may help, but again you can't presume that once you've been on an advanced riding course you are now bulletproof. A quick straw poll among the IAM riders that meet at my local showed that every one of them I spoke to had crashed more often than me. Common sense is the only cure.
Hi viz isn't cool, but it probably keeps you out of hospital, especially on a push bike. I commuted 4 years in central London on mine and preferred the fluo jacket. It might make you look like a penis, but less of a penis than spending the rest of your days in a wheelchair. When it's spitting with rain, getting dark and you're doing Hyde Park Corner in the rush hour, I want to give all the cars attempting to occupy my little bit of the road as much chance of seeing me as possible. And if you think a noddy little bike light does that... On a motorbike, there is less chance of you being shunted up the rear because you're normally travelling faster than those following you. This means that you should at least be able to spot the people who are going to kill you. But even so, I don't think wearing black leathers with a black bike is especially intelligent. Who are you trying to be, the Invisible Man? So for my rides out, gaudy Power Ranger kit for me, but if I'm just nipping to the supermarket (almost never by bike) then I might consider something more sober. I don't get the black leathers plus dayglo police waistcoat thing. That's just the worst of both worlds.
Now thats a good idea hi vis car paint jobs..... maybe make those j walking pedestrians t**ts wear them too.. in fact just high vis everything and everyone will be safe out there..:frown:
Well, I can't help feeling that black and grey cars (about 90% of them then) are not only sad, unimaginative, but also not very safe. Driving around in less than perfect visibility (rain, fog, dusk) you just can't see them. What happened to all the red, blue, yellow, orange whatever cars? Now we drive how we dress - monochrome.
so this outfit is safer than my all black leathers and helmet on my all black bike? I was only asking
Must admit when I'm out on the nags, the hi-viz really helps with other road users compared to not having it on. People give you a wider berth and tend to drive in a more cautious manner - noticeably! I did have a tabard that said "Please pass wide and slow", but a friend said is that to get round your horse or your arse, so now gone to a plain one!!!!
it might stop cars from pulling out in front of ya i normally like to wear a hi-vis whilst abroad, especially after a few close calls going round paris, those scare the shit out of me!
Well, after taking in some points from this thread, I actually wore higher vis gear than usual when out on my run tonight. guess cyclists, joggers, jockeys and similar slower stuff will be better off with it. But on the 998 with loud pipes, don't think wearing hi vis will do anything for my mortality.
