There wont be a round 2, i said at the end of my post each has a different opinion and so be it and i thought that was fair enough without being too off hand ....... He told me i was wrong, i disagreed and thought that was the end of it i then find i get a neg rating on the post and chapter and verse about "its water off a ducks back to me BUT ..... blah blah" and finished with "i take exception to that " which genuinely made me laugh He quite clearly hasn't got a clue about the ride modes as all the 3 road modes make the Multi virtually unrideable on gravel and the ruts and washboard ripples you find on tracks due to 4X4's digging up the corners on exits .....switch to enduro which backs off the traction control and lets the rear tyre spin and hence grip up and drive the bike forward and it makes it useable off road..... i doubt Ducati engineers cringed at all, they probably thought it was a brilliant idea to widen the capability of the bike but like some owners of ADV bikes he "thinks" he knows the concept and dismisses it but has never actually tried it ....and yet i am the one who fell for the marketing bullshit I am not that precious about it so he can carry on with his blinkered vision on what a bike should be used for and i'll carry on riding the Multi off road which apparently is as sensible "to eating broken glass" I rode mine a few hundred miles on tracks and loose gravel roads on road tyres (Bridgestone T30) and full luggage but i am wrong and make as much sense taking it off road "like a fish riding a bicycle" Have a look at the video, its fairly smooth but still gravel till 9 minutes, thenit gets rougher at 13 minutes and the last couple of minutes is a rock fest up a very steep incline but the only route to the top of 5,300 foot mountain and spectacular views... i remember that at the start the bike was in my usual "Sport" setting but the traction control was too intrusive and kept cutting the power on the wash board ripples so i switched to the "Enduro" mode (apparently a bullshit move by Ducati to suck in people who believe the marketing hype) which made life a lot simpler and left some spin ups once i got used to it...... i am no Dakar hero but this was completed with the last 10 minutes stood on the pegs for control and allowing the electronics to be wound back completely or the bike would have ground to a halt and stopped as the terrain would have confused the electronics completely I do know one thing for certain and its fact and not an opinion he can disagree with and also backed up it with video evidence ....without that capability and being on the Multi and trusting in its ability to cope with the off road i wouldnt have got to see some of the most stunning bits of the beautiful country that is Norway without the level of stress and difficulty i would have had on many other options
So are we any closer to finding a multi alternative ? I have come to this conclusion, I was never a Ducati fan boy until I got a multi , now nothing else ignites my passion, if it's not a Ducati, well it's not a Ducati. there is simply no alternative for me, my only choice is which Ducati multi to choose,1200, 950, Enduro, S, Standard, Pikes Peak, white , Red, Volcano Grey, what accessories to finish it off ? Forget looking for alternatives. All you need is here already.
Bigyin, nice video. Some of us do value your opinion and are not boring know it alls that like to listen themselves. We all have different opinions and should respect that. Thanks for taking the high road.
Agreed. For me a 1200S DVT in red with touring & luggage is the answer. So I have just ordered a new one from Snells, to be collected on 11 April 2017. They've accepted the previous one (2015, still in warranty - just) in part-ex, and whoever buys it will get a superb bike.
Nice video clip. I've ridden similar roads on my multi, often 2 up with luggage. Solo stood up is easy, less so 2 up, the pegs are in the wrong place to do so comfortably. Also the rubber tops make them dangerous if muddy. Last year I did 2 weeks in South Africa on a GS riding far worse roads (70%+ was off road, lots of lesotho). The GS was the right tool only because of its fuel range. It's still a compromised choice, just the best compromise for that trip. I would have liked to have tried a multi enduro or an XR but that wasn't an option. A friend of mine who has had a bunch of multi including a 15 dvt, and now owns a bmw RT and a ktm 1290 GT summed it up perfectly Imo. The RT is a great tourer and compromised for sports riding. The ktm is a great sports bike but a crap tourer. The multi is really good at both. Yes it's a compromise but the best compromise. If he had to have only one bike, the multi would be it.
Bigyin, can you please just answer one question? Why, in your opinion, did Ducati release an Enduro version of the Multistrada? Was it purely for aesthetics or for some other reason?
i have 2014 multi 3 year old now test rode the bmw 1000 XR fast and vibe but ugly now seriously try the yamaha mt10 ...its unbelieavably good its so fast it creams over my multi and the BMW if you can live with the transformer looks
I did exactly that before I swapped my Multi for an XR. I was quite excited as it looked to me that by adding the high screen, quick shifter, comfort seat, heated grips etc. you could make a serious alternative to a Multi or XR for a bit over £11k. But 90 miles to the fuel light coming on and about 120 miles maximum tank range compromises it as an all rounder. I couldn't even do my normal Sunday "lap" on it without a fill up! Deal breaker for me. Wasn't particularly impressed with A mode = snatchy, B mode = ridiculously snatchy either. Maybe the cross plane crank is deceptive but I didn't think it would cream my Multi or the XR? Apparently Yamaha have no intention of making a Tracer version of the MT-10, even my local Yamaha dealer who i have known for 30+ years doesn't understand them. Seriously, I don't get the Japanese, they spent 30 years selling us sports bikes and have completely failed to understand that now we are getting older we still want the performance and dynamics but need some comfort too.
I just recently swapped my 2016 MT-10 for a 2017 MT-10SP to go alongside my 2016 Multistrada DVT, they're completely different bikes or I wouldn't have decided to own both. You're absolutely right, the tank range is appalling which immediately rules it out of any serious touring duty. The group of riders I tour Germany with would get seriously miffed if I had to stop every 100 miles. The reserve is very short too so when that light comes on you can't mess about, you've GOT TO get fuel. They've changed the mappings for 2017 and they're much more sensible and no way near as jerky in the equivalent A and B modes. They've doing a "Touring" version but it's just a standard MT-10 with a screen, hand-guards, comfort seat and soft pannier options pre-fitted. Prior to the launch of the MT-10 and already being an MT-09 owner I was hoping for a 4-cylinder Tracer and when it didn't materialise I went straight out and bought the Multistrada. By August last year I'd done 8000 miles on my Multistrada and the MT-10 finally became available in dealers and so I decided to buy one to share the mileage around a bit, plus give myself the choice of a twin or a four cylinder, because sometimes I get bored of one or the other and fancy a change. Their really isn't a comparison here either as the MT-10 is much closer to being a naked R1 than the Multistrada is to being a naked Panigale. Wicked bike though, and in terms of performance it does completely run rings around the Multistrada but I didn't buy the Multistrada to ride when my hairs on fire. I bought it to munch through the miles quickly and to be comfortable on my 100 mile a day commute. When my hairs on fire then that's what my MT-10SP is for.
The Multistrada took sales away from BMW GS and BMW came back with the S1000XR to try and get back some of the "upright sport bike" seeking buyers but there are still many who would pick a GSA over a standard Multi due to the styling and more importantly the bigger fuel tank and adv luggage offered by the GSA despite the fact the vast majority will never use either for what it is ultimately capable of. The standard 20L tank doesnt last that long when fully loaded with full luggage and really cracking on (not helped by the size of the 73L panniers as opposed to the standard 58's) ..... I filled up near Calais and needed a refuel at Stansted services on the M11 which is about 120 miles but that was in a hurry. You probably wont agree but i think (you did ask my opinion) Ducati saw the opportunity to steal more sales from BMW by putting out a bike that matched all the points the GSA scored over the standard bike. Again, in my opinion, the change in 1st gear and longer travel forks as well as the twin sided swingarm and spoked wheels will be more durable to off road use but the standard bike with the 20L tank will be easier to manage off road than the 30L Enduro and also is 22KG lighter when fully fuelled but the vast majority of owners will fit touring tyres and use it as a continental mile muncher (like your own Germany trips) If Enduro style luggage was available for mine when i bought it i would have taken it as its so much more practical when on a camping trip (and makes a good seat) rather than pulling out a pannier bag and walking into a hotel I have ridden my own 2013, a new DVT and the Enduro, all within a week or so of each other and i am not sure if i would actually go for the Enduro as its such a "big" feeling bike and even at 6 foot 1 its the first bike i have ever felt like i was "reaching" to get both feet flat when stopped due to the increased 870mm seat height over the standard 840 .... add on some knobblies and thats more reach
I love my multi but it gets murdered by the yamaha on acceleration, top end and knee down scratching so so fast I'm really tempted to get one now they do a touring version the 30 miles tank range difference isn't a issue
It was a really straight forward question and could have been answered in a single sentence, so excuse me if I cut out all the stuff which is either incorrect or simply makes no sense from a sales or manufacturing perspective. Bingo! We got there ... well almost. Replace the word "durable" with "suitable" and you're pretty much spot on. You do know why LARGER 19" or 21" spoked wheels are used on off road bikes as opposed to 17" cast wheels? And why 21" spoked wheels don't suit a pure road or track bike, right? 17" wheels get stuck in ruts and pot-holes and larger diameter wheels tend to facilitate easier traversal of much harsher riding surfaces. 19" or 21" wheels tend not to disappear into small-ish pot-holes. Conversely, larger diameter wheels means bigger diameter tyres, spoked wheels to overcome the weight of a cast wheel of the same size but also to add a capability to withstand damage and facilitate repair any damage rather than simply break and compromise the entire wheel. None of which is relevant if we only ride on tarmac, where a stiffer, smaller 17" wheel is the right tool for the job. The main reason that we don't use 19" or 21" wheels on a road bike where we care about handling, is because the gyroscopic moment of a larger wheel is much greater at high speed and therefore compromises handling, hence the reason you can't even buy a lot of recognised sport-touring tyres in those sizes. Bridgestone T30 Evo? Forget it. It's an entirely sensible and appropriate tyre for a Multistrada over the standard OE fitment, largely because I could ride off the edge with of the OE Pirelli Skorpions, whereas I have chicken-strips on my Bridgestone T30 Evo's and I'm bloody glad I do too! I think we can leave this right here.
As I expected, told me my opinion was wrong and concluded with a patronising, selectively edited, out of context response Don't know why I even bothered to reply
Come on boys it's only about a motorcycle alternative Strictly speaking a v twin can't really be compared with in line 4's triples etc. Horses for courses
Patronising? Probably, but then given your previous posts you really don't give anyone the impression that you completely understand the purpose of the machines and the configuration you're comparing as you told me that comparing wheels sizes is an over-simplification when it's entirely fundamental for the reasons I've just explained. Since you've clearly not given me the impression that you understand the purpose of these changes I've had to explain them just to make sure you understand the significance. If you did understand then I apologise for being patronising but at the same time that would indicate that you DO understand the difference in which case you're being disingenuous. Selectively edited? My reply was to focus on one thing, the thing which you skirted around and dressed up in a load of assumed hyperbole about market-share-this and steal-sales-that, most of which contradicted itself. Why would Ducati go to the bother of launching a different model when they're already, as you stated, taking sales from BMW GS (which they're probably not as it's BMW's top selling model)? None of it makes sense, so I elected to ignore it and focus on the thing that this debate was about. It's called "cutting to the chase". Out of context? Definitely not. I asked a question, you answered (in a drawn out way), I quoted the significant part about the key differences and replied. No change of context there whatsoever. I didn't change you text or edit your response to change the meaning in anyway, and to suggest that I have is pretty low.
Bigyin, you took his bait once again. Rainman will not rest until you give up. He will out type, out quote, and out bs you. He is a legend in his own mind.
My first interaction with him and stupidly thought being asked for my opinion was genuine Thank for the heads up, ignored from now on ta
That is right, it is an obscure forum rule. People who use a screen name that is the title of a film starring Tom Cruise and Dustin Hoffman about autism are not allowed opinions.
