That was my fear, I'm not bothered at all about a transitional period and continued financial contributions during this time as long as we fully leave. I was fearful that a transitional period would be used to ultimately keep us in the EU or at least in some diluted form. As long as we leave in 2021, I'll be a happy camper.
Not all business as you imply but most of those asking in the way spoilt children do, will always get to 2 years, then demand more then when that is up, demand more. Business needs to know it's place in countries with a democracy I saw her speech and if you compare her brexit means brexit, then staying in the eu for an extra 2 years whilst losing a seat at the top table but still allowing open door immigration, the ecj to still rule us legally even with new laws they may make up in that period and still paying billions for the privilege whilst the eu does not move one inch, then yes she has been bent over the kitchen table and let the UK been royally poked up the arse and she has sold us out. The transition however was going to be needed on somethings but for her to give everything away means the October party conference could be a decider for her even more so as she was not exact on the timeline I still however, have a sneaking feeling that more because of eu stability amongst the 27 after we leave, the eu will not budge an inch feeling they now have the upper hand and they will still push for wto. If that is the case then May by offering more than we want to give will look like the good guy when negotiations break down. I've seen nothing yet to suggest she is that politically astute so today it feels like she has shafted Britain in a way the eu could not. We haven't reached the end game yet so lets see where that takes us? Duke you are the only one who has had to pay up yet when wrong and given one of your last "must read as it's true" was from vanity fair, I'm sure you will understand why your inputs are so funny and often wrong bless you
Britains economic outlook has just been downgraded. We need a people's revolution to oust the ruling classes.
Silly man, what? So we can replace them with Sir Keir starmer and the other millionaires on labours side ? As to business and certainty, the trade deals being mentioned before with India, Australia, Canada etc will now have to wait a further 2 years as we will not be able to deal with them till we definitely leave. I fail to see the business stability in deals not being acted upon till 2021 possibly
Hardly, just discussing the situation, looking at the facts at hand. You should give it a try instead of just making up sound bites each one more ridiculous than the last. I didn't have to look far, one post above and you are calling for a public revolution. You've been bricking it for 18 months now and continue to do so. Scroll back through some of your predictions of Armageddon with a cup of tea and a packet of Hob Nobs They are very amusing.
Without a clear understanding of what will happen at the end of the transition period we are just kicking the can down the road. What will change during the transition period? Meanwhile, according to Michel Barnier, we will have to obey the rules without having a vote.
I'm not 'bricking it' in the slightest, try being pragmatic Duke as opposed to hysterical or pessimistic, thats the way to do it. As I've said, this is still a negotiation, some people think yesterday's speech was the end and now that's it, personally what I witnessed was one side of a negotiation publicly saying 'work with us and we'll work with you ' It was a public olive branch with an undertone of 'over to you fellas' with the EU negotiators next up to bat. I still think WTO rules are coming, but this speech will change how the blame game will work when they do. What her speech did was to show to the moaners and critics that the UK negotiations team is willing to make this work, as it has been all along. It's actually quite clever really as remainers and other critics seem to see the EU negotiators in a very neutral light and push blame on the UK side for everything. Well her speech for the world to see now means that the EU team have to start showing some willingness to also make this work, otherwise it's them that look stubborn and inflexible to the citizens and businesses across Europe. As noob and quite a few others have said it's unlikely that they will, or even want to offer a deal worthwhile for us to stay in the customs union and single market. It would make the future harder to control for them with other European countries quite possibly wanting their own leave vote. No they'd prefer us to leave and trade under WTO as those rules are already in place, but to make talks fail now they'll have to push on with more unreasonable demands but this time they'll be very publicly unreasonable and likely start carrying some blame themselves. May will have offered 'some money' a little over and above what's necessary following analysis and proper costing of the EU's previously tabled divorce bill, in other words the money offered will be a more accurate amount. Now the EU team can either continue with the initial demands they started with which may have been purposefully designed to make talks fail due to the size of the figures, or they'll have to forget that play entirely and come up with something else. Whatever they switch to will now be under closer analysis, therefore the public and media might start to see through them. It's more about rallying support this speech and it's about time that certain people and the media stopped looking at the head table of the EU with rose tinted glasses.
If you look at what was being asked by the eu and what was offered yesterday If you believe the headlines, the eu was after around 100 billion euros, May seemed to offer only 2 years more membership fee's, so around 20 billion The eu wanted to know how we were going to manage the Northern Ireland/Republic of Ireland border, May said yesterday we will find creative ways to deal with this but again no specifics The eu wanted to know our every move in regards to eu nationals here and coming here, May said those who are here we want to keep but anyone after 2019 they must apply and be registered On the 3 key issues the eu asked to be resolved before they go into negotiating their future arrangement, she has said basically that she will work with the eu, but either has very few specifics to offer or she knows it's going to wto so very little will be declared. I see Macron this morning is already pointing out a lot has been said but the 3 key issues still have no meat on the bone and they have the meeting next month to see whether enough progress has been made so they can start the life after leaving negotiations. I suspect as the eu wanted 10 years membership fee's as a leaving fee, that 20 billion is unlikely be accepted as that still leaves the remaining 27 still having to fund that claimed shortfall I feel this morning, that the speech was little more than offering platitudes of intentions and suggestions to give the impression that at least one side is trying so lets move on. It's now upto the eu to either try and hide that they have wanted wto all along or come up with the reasons why we can't go further. In my mind still, Junker and his direct cronies have taken us leaving as a personal insult and if he was allowed to be honest, he would say, we want to punish you so we will not deal with you, you will have no access using our own advantages and there will be no bespoke deal, you left us, deal with it and do as we want you to do, go to wto. Any country considering leaving the eu, this is how you will be dealt with, no buffett lunch where you pick and mix but a simple non on negotiations, do not pass go and do not collect £200 but just go straight to wto
your usual nonsense links added to by scary headlines with no information, you're unlikely to change so I will seek to translate your nonsense again Tis true moody's has downgraded the U.K. rating but due to the eu situation and the huge unsustainable personal and automotive debt. A better link with all the reasoning why duke, would have been the one from moody's themselves https://www.moodys.com/research/Moo...g-to-Aa2-changes-outlook-to-stable--PR_372649 To understand it also as duke is the type of person who would say the pound is crashing when it even drops 0.003 then let me use wiki as it shows all the main agencies and explains who has what https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_credit_rating Scroll down to moody's, They have changed the U.K. from Aa1 to Aa2 to have some perspective. Aa2 is also the current banding of France, Hong Kong, Kuwait, Qatar, UAE and still remains one of the highest not only in europe but the world also.
WTO rules will damage the UK economy for years to come and make this a very expensive country to live in.
Given most countries outside of the eu that deal with the eu, use wto, could you explain with facts, why the wto would be bad for the U.K. in a way it is not for the rest of the world, when dealing with the eu?
Once again and for the 387th time. We are a net importer if goods from the EU, WTO tarrifs applied reciprocally would boost the UK economy and allow any firms exporting from the UK to the EU to be compensated by the UK govt and still leave a large ammount of money left over.
Oh yes, Mr Macron. Now let's think about this, the man who desperately needs to show he's doing something for the undercut and undervalued workforce of France, a man who will need Juncker et al to help him pull off the charade of 'change'. A man so preened and molded for front line political statements he spends upwards of £20k / month on makeup to look as pretty as possible and a far cry from those pulling his strings Yes Mr Macron, the puppet. I wonder who wheeled him out center stage? Mon Dieu
Exactly. I would also add that it was an appeal to the 27 and business leaders to put some pressure on the EU to get on with it. However I don't think the EU and their negotiators are willing to accept anything other than total capitulation, which is why I agree that in all probability we will end up under WTO rules.
You mean it isn't already? Have you never heard of Rip-Off Britain? Which is what the EU has been doing for ages and looks as though they are still going to.
