Just to warn others as green as me... I have had a bit of a nightmare with my current project over the summer. One specific issue has been stickers... It seems that there are several suppliers of 'Ducati' sticker sets that are not 'fit for purpose' in my book. I would expect that any sticker I purchased for a 1990's restoration project would be 'lacquer safe'. If not, I would expect that this would be made clear on the website, or even in the packaging. This has not been the case. I have even had a supplier send one sticker set that was safe, and an additional replacement that was not! I have been told that the old printing machines that make proper OEM stickers can print silver (as on the 1990's cagiva font) but new technology inkjet printers cant, so they print white and black onto silver background. The old machines are very expensive, the inkjet machines are cheap. There is also the issue of environmental legislation which is affecting the paint industry and causing some old processes to be more difficult to do. The old type printers use a process that is solvent safe - you can wipe these down with pre-paint and spray solvent lacquer over them. The Inkjet prints are NOT automatically solvent safe - perhaps that can be fixed, but the two I have purchased have been ruined simply by wiping with pre-paint, and would be eaten by solvent lacquer. They might be OK with water soluble lacquer, but this is not normally used in paint shops. Someone might be able to correct me if I have been misinformed, or add information. The outcome for me has been delay and expense when the panel has had to be resprayed and new stickers sourced - TWICE! If you are buying stickers try and get some assurance the lacquer you are intending to use will be OK on the sticker. Definitely test the sticker before application. Get an assurance you can have full money back and return postage if the sticker is not fit for purpose. I will only purchase from one shop now.
Do you have a picture of what your trying to achieve? Im curious as to whether its silver chrome, or a silver matt finish? I would presume they used to be screened and that may well be your problem, setting up a screen print just to produce one set of decals or even a few will be hideously expensive. Digital reproduction is just as good if not better as long as the correct care is taken and spec given prior to production. In regards to a modern solvent printer producing a proper 'chrome / shiny' silver then the best I've seen is the Mimaki Cjv. Most current ink jet printers using a solvent ink don't have the ability to recreate a chrome type silver, those that claim to actually only have a metallic ink, not necessarily silver silver (shiny) The Mimaki Cjv on the other hand produces a really good chrome by using ink and this can be produced on a decent polymeric white vinyl. In regards to whether they are 'lacquer safe' and ok to wipe down with a solvent cleaner i would say probably not without them being laminated or coated in a lacquer of some sort prior to application, and then wiping them down. Most solvent inks tend to bite in to the surface of a self adhesive vinyl to a degree, but i know that metallic & silver solvent inks tend to sit more on the surface otherwise they lose the silvering effect. (hence why they'd be easy to agitate when rubbed with a solvent solution) Having said that, something like a Gerber Edge foil print unit may work ok as they have loads of special films available. Where in the world are you? I know a company in Cardiff that has both the Gerber and Mimaki CJV
Many of the original decals are still available from ducati. Worth checking with your dealer or drop me a pm with what you need.
You sound very knowledgeable - I am trying to achieve a set of 1992 Superlight decals. Like these These are examples of the large DUCATI on my other fairings - The sticker on the red fairing seems slightly more silvery that the others, but it might just be lighting conditions. I'm not sure which of these would be OEM. This is my sad story... I originally ordered a custom printed set of these stickers (with a slight variation) from a UK supplier - these were destroyed with pre-paint wipe. No restitution, vendor claimed 'it had never happened before' I then bought a set from an international supplier - these claimed to be OEM. They were OK. BUT for other reasons (they were stuck on too soon, and bubbled up) the large DUCATI on the fairing had to be replaced. I bought another complete set from same international supplier (To make sure the replacement was identical) - the DUCATI was smaller! About 1cm shorter, so very noticeable (go figure, same item, same cost, same vendor!). I then asked them to send the right size, which they did free of charge, this replacement sticker was destroyed by the pre-paint. So it must have been printed using a different technology. I am still waiting to hear their explanation. The panel is being resprayed (again) and I am using the smaller DUCATI sticker from the second set form international supplier (from a small survey I conducted on the Facebook page, it seems the smaller size was more correct anyway). I separately bought a custom sticker from A-Z Stickers, Wesgate Hill, Newcastle for the tail. Michael is the source of my information on the types of process. His machine is capable of printing lacquer safe stickers and he does not inkjet print at all.
Personally I'd send the details to Nelly and see if you can get some original decals. At least those are perfect so no chance of you being unhappy. However, I'd still avoid rubbing them with a solvent cleaner as it's just not necessary. Use a less aggressive cleaner prior to painting on the lacquer. If not oem from Nelly, what you need is not impossible to produce digitally, probably the Gerber edge might be best bet looking at them. The issue is reproducing the correct silver as it looks Matt to me, and the tone may not match unless you have a target to aim for (existing decal you're happy with)
Just to be clear, there was no rubbing involved - the inkjet ink just dissolves at the first hint of any solvent - the lacquer alone would eat the sticker even if you did not use the pre-paint.
'Ink jet' Inks come in a range of types, it's more a description of the technology used to print more so than the ink itself. Solvent, Uv, aqueous and dye sublimation are all an ink type and there are still others which are used within different machines using 'ink jet' technology. I can't comment on the decals you've had to date, but I've had decals produced for previous bikes and paint jobs by using a solvent ink, those were lacquered over absolutely fine. Most Roland and Mimaki printers use a solvent ink and will be widely used in most signage and decal places.
Pretty much all the fairing decals appear to be available. The seat decals not so. Only one or two are showing as available now. There is a split on that year, as there is for many of that era, on chassis numbers though.
So, do we have to specify 'solvent ink' to ensure a good result?... I am just using the forum to raise the issue, as I had no clue that stickers advertised for sale from several sources could be worse than useless. What is even more worrying is that one supplier has provided some that do work and some that fail. This means that one cannot even rely on a 'trusted' supplier.
There are a range of laser jet machines that now have a 5th toner cartridge in addition to the usual CMYK. That 5th cartridge can be a number of special colours but the most common flavour is clear toner. This can be placed over the usual toner to give a shiny finish. It may be worth finding someone with one of those.
Not at all, I'm just telling you that the vast majority of signage and / or retail graphics suppliers (printers) within the UK market, and no doubt Europe will use a solvent printer or at least know what one is. The only caveat would be likely a HP latex, but in essence they all do the same thing. Vehicle decals in theory could be produced in all manner of ways, litho runs are high volume, screen print still high volume but slightly less so, solvent, latex & gerber are all fairly short run digital devices hence why I would have thought that might be a good place to start. Ultimately, if the original decals are available they'll be exactly what you want. Anyone else making them and they'll be a reproduction, close but not exactly the same. Also, where are you getting this 'trusted supplier' thing from? Is it someone you've been recommended or something? The fact that two sets have been done and both differed in size shows that the attention to detail isn't there so I'm just curious. FYI some industry background searched at random just to show how widely the machines and technologies I've mentioned are used. https://www.imagereportsmag.co.uk/features/technical/tech-knowledge/4716-latex-vs-solvent https://www.rolanddg.co.uk/industry/vehicle-graphics http://www.gspinc.com/downloads/pdf/testimonials/tm_edge_trumps-inkjet.pdf Personally, I'd just try a different supplier and explain the issues you've had to date or buy the genuinely ones. Appreciate youve had some issues, but honestly it shouldn't be this hard. I've done loads before for myself and worked within digital print for longer than I care to remember.
Image works are literally 10 minutes ride from my house and they too have both screen and digital print capabilities. They do decent stuff but again I can't see why the op is struggling, unless what he's been sold isn't what he's being told it is.
Hi everyone, I've been following the debate for a while, and now I need to get on with it! I want my Superlight (pattern) seat painted up Mark II style, with white number boards and the "ducati campione del mondo superbike" stickers, butwithout the racing number. Is it best to get the seat sprayed red and then use decals for the rest, following up with lacquer? If so, does anyone have experience of using the set offered by classicreproductiondecalsandparts :https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DUCATI-9...665842?hash=item4b329c85b2:g:VkMAAOSwNRdX85nk ? Thanks
I got these from Image Works. They do different thicknesses depending on whether you want them for lacquering or not. I got the thicker ones for the boards as they were going on top of the lacquer. I got them made with the wee "....campione del mondo..." bit printed at the bottom. I had the 1s seperate to go onto the board. I think they can make it up as you like. Call them and discuss. I also got most of the others made up for lacquering, as per the Ducati across the tail in the pic.
