Hello Gentlemen and ladies. Ive been having an issue with my 1299 Pani S for a while, I have tried to diagnose/fix through process of elimination but I am finally at my wits end. If anyone here can maybe help in any way I would be forever grateful. The problem: The bike sits on an optimate charger from Monday to Firday. She is ridden on Saturday (maybe) and Sunday (definitely). When I go to start her up for the first time, she will fire up as normal, idle for 3 seconds then die. After that, when trying to start her up again, the bike sounds like its on the brink of just about to ignite but can't quite make it. Turns over strongly , huffs and puffs, fires but wont ignite. If I then just wait for a few seconds and then try 2 more times, she eventually fires up and stays on. And by now she stinks of petrol. Once the bike is started up, she will then fire up no problems at any later stage during the same day, and even the next day without problem. It only appears to happen after its been sitting for a few days. It appears to be getting slightly worse as time goes by now. where she wont start first time, and the 2nd time she starts but smells of fuel. Coincidentally, if she starts the first time and I hold higher revs with the throttle it seems to stop the bike dying on me, but this is just masking the problem, its not a fix. I just dont get it! Bike has done 23,000 miles. Has the full race akra system with the ducati up map and sprint filter. So far, I have changed, but not seen any difference: 1. New battery, good quality battery, (Not lithium) left on optimate charger when bike not in use. 2. Changed Spark plugs. 3. Checked vacuum hoses under fuel tank as these can sometimes pinch or crack when old. Replaced them with new ones... Any ideas? Thanks in advance to all.
Just poking.... I'd be looking at coils, or ignition circuits including fuel pump plus relays, followed shortly by sensor values, Crankcase position sensor, plus your AFR and throttle position sensors. I've seen the OE birds nest of wires with poor rooting etc.... sounds like that's going to be a hard one to find. Good luck
I’m wondering if it’s a fuel pump issue as you’ve said there’s a strong smell of fuel afterwards! It may be worth giving the lads at moto rapido or Nelly off here a call and explain the symptoms,I’m sure they will be able to help, good luck hope you get it started! Of course the other fix would be ride it every day!lol
Strange one as only seems present when engine is cold after being sat for a few days. If I'm reading it correctly once its fired up and warm the problem does not occur on further start ups. Long shot but could it be water in the fuel? Obviously not ethanols intended use but the ethanol in fuel these days separates the water out from the fuel, when left to stand. With water having a greater SG than petrol it sits at the bottom of the tank and is subsequently drawn up by the fuel pump when starting from cold / standing. The current cold ambient temps would also help this theory as water in the fuel will condense out when left for a few days, so could be a perfect storm of conditions. Easy test is shake the bike before starting to mix the fuel back up and if it fires and runs OK I would suggest the above as a likely cause. Had this happen myself through experience. Other suggestion is check the airfilter as AFR could be well out if air filter is heavily soiled.
It kinda sounds like leaking injectors. The injectors leak when the bike is not running, the longer its left the more fuel pools ,when it is started it fires then is flooded. You could check a spark plug after the first time it fails to start. See if its soaking wet.
I had my 1299 remapped a couple of years ago as I found it rough at low speeds and start up was always hit and miss, my guy reckons the fueling was absolutely horrible for a modern bike and the remap sorted my issues, don't know if that helps any
Gents that's excellent feedback thank you. I will try the easiest first. The quality of fuel where I am is awful so this could possibly be the reason. Will also check the air filter. Totally forgot that. Two questions. 1. If my injectors are leaking. Would it be possible to see this if i remove the tank and air filter? If so what should i be looking for. 2. If i remove the fuel pump, can i clean the mesh filter that's inside? Anyone tried this? Thanks gentlemen
it would depend how bad its leaking. You said when you get it started it will run and start the rest of the day. So it may take hours to see the first drip of fuel, but over a day/s is when it all builds up.
I'd take the plugs out, sometime after you've been for a run but before you try and start the bike for the next time from cold. Plug colour tells you a lot about how an engine is running. Depending on what you see, you can go from there.
Thank you Uk_Biker and Travelling man. I will post my findings in case someone else in the future has this issue, as I guess there are not many 1299 S with 24,000 miles on the clock.
There are no error codes present on the dash, correct? If you read the stored trouble codes with diagnostic software (such as MelcoDiag), have any faults been recorded? What year is the bike? Have you ever changed or thoroughly examined the "O" ring on the quick-release gas tank fuel coupler? At 23,000+ miles, there's a 99.99% chance that the "O" ring, even if not the cause of this particular problem, should be renewed. When the bike does fire, how does it perform at 7000 RPM and above? Does it pull strong or sputter? Have you examined the inside of the airbox?
i would be looking at what you have changed, and as you have an air filter replacement i would start under the tank. make sure you have the fuel pipe connection to the injectors seated correctly in its retainer, it needs to click into place if i remember correctly, as you remove this to pull the filter ( the upper inlet with the injectors mounted)
Just to resurrect this topic in case anyone has or will have the same issues as I had. I meticulously covered every option offered above, because they were all valid points. The Sprint air filter, eventhough being only 12 months old was absolutely filthy. But that just made it run smoother. It didnt affect the startup then shut down issue. Everything else above checked out ok. So Lo and Behold, for a whole month; just before I fired her up for the first time, (and the bike has been sitting for 6 days) I give her a very good shake left and right and back and forth, and she fired up and didnt die on me. Not once! Must say I was dubious. So this whole month, I continued doing this specifically after the bike had been sitting all week and it fired every time. So as BladeRR8 mentioned above, because it sits so long, (and the quality of fuel here is not great anyway, dont know if this play a role or not here) the water must have been separating and sitting at the bottom. So when I would fire her up, the pump would suck the water in, then the bike would die. Leaving me with having to crank the bike over until it mixes again. I actually thought it was a long shot, and couldnt believe it when it worked consisitently every weekend. Hope it helps others.
