Replaced the basket and plates today Basically if the springs are nipped right up the clutch drags a little and its difficult to get into neutral If the springs are backed off then it seems ok Does this mean it would be adviseable to reduce the stack height a little? At the moment the plates are right to the edge of the drum - using a height of 38.5 Also have a speedymoto clutch cover that has been fine for normal clutch cover but when I have fitted an oberon pressure plate it fouls the cover? It doesn't foul if I remove a friction plate and a steel - question I guess is how many frictions and steels should I have and am I right in measuring the stack height by adding together the steels and frictions? Have 7 frictions each 3mm 21 8 steels each 2mm 16 1 steel 1.5mm (conve) 1.5 Therefore 38.5......?
Apologies for grandmother - egg sucking reply; but have you re-bled the clutch system after taking it apart? Sometimes I have to, sometimes I don't... taking the clutch rod out sometimes means i have to re-bleed it... A minute bit of air and you won't get the full movement of the clutch separating... Bob
Don't worry re teaching me to suck eggs lol! havent re bled the clutch - will do is the clutch plate supposed to sit on the drum at all times? I ask because the last steel comes to the every edge of the drum - is that normal ?
Mine is in bits at the moment; so I just had a quick look at it... The final steel plate is sitting just over a mil below the lip of the basket... Mine is an after market slipper from JHP... this link might be worth a read... Clutch Tuning - Ducati Up North I can recall we had issue setting up my mates sigma slipper unit... That was a long time ago, but i seem to recall that not all the steel plates were the same thickness.... we had a few spares and swapped them round to get the sweet spot between dragging and slipping... Without spare plates to play around with, then I don't know what that answer is... not sure if taking out a friction and steel plate will be too much...?? but If I were you I'd consider getting a vernier gauge on all your steel plates to check that they are indeed all 2mm thick... I was gifted a nice part by bradders this weekend; so if your short of some plates to mix them up let me know what you need and you can have them... I've still got my original clutch hiding around somewhere... pretty sure i still have a selection of steel plates... Bob
Backing off the spring screws and it working, sounds like you may be getting the springs coil bound. Has the new pressure plate gone on at the same time as new plates? The speedymoto covers are pretty generous with clearance for the plate as well, so the Oberon plate may be causing your problems.
Its a non-slipper- using new basket and plates, existing drum and steels plus new pressure plate Have verniered all plates and am certain the stack total is 38.5 Started with 2 steels then friction, alternating steels apart from 2 in where its dished at 1.5mm Last plate is steel 2mm Is it normal for the plates to reach virtually the very edge of the drum? Whats to stop the last steel dropping between the pressure plate and drum? Nelly - what do you mean by coil bound? It is a new plate. If I take off a steel that then leave a couple of mm left on the drum, the pressure plate then locates onto that and there seems to be much more clearance. Is the pressure plate supposed to locate on the drum at rest - it looks like its designed to Sorry for all the qs - first time had a clutch apart through necessity of needing to change
Yes, the cover should engage with the drum and sit over it. Is it aligned properly? There is a slot in one of the spring posts and there should be a dot marked on the pressure plate. These fit together. Spring bound is when the springs are compressed so that they essentially become tubes. As you tighten the spring caps down, check how close the coils are together. What does the lever feel like? It usually goes solid before it reaches the bars. There is nothing to stop the last steel dropping off the drum.... You want about 3-4mm of drum showing past the last clutch plate. Don't get hung up on pack thickness.
Thanks Nelly Yes the lever comes to a hard 'stop' before the bars- does that mean then that the springs are too long? If so does that mean with the oberon I would need different springs to standard? I swapped back to the stock plate and that seemed cured however the plates were still too close to the edge of the drum I assume that re plate thickness I am ok losing some stack height with thinner steels? I have quite a few 1.5mm straight steels I could use to gain me some space - or am I better losing a friction and steel so I am just running 6 friction plates? Really appreciate the help especially before I tackle the slipper on my 1198 lol
You've defo got spring binding then. Are the springs stock, or aftermarket? By the sounds of it, the pack is too thick anyhow. You can reduce pack width by either fitting 1.5mm plates or losing a friction and a steel. Reducing the pack will give the springs a better chance as well. I'd go down that route first
Spring binding aside, depending on the type of master/slave cylinder ratio (clutch travel) I find that 38mm is the maximum I can get away with and still expect to find neutral when stopped. On both the 916 and Monster I have aftermarket (less force required) setups and both need the full amount of lever travel to select neutral whilst stationary. Using some thinner steel plates to get under 38mm definitely helps me and a new clutch pack is always worse until it wears a little.
Thats brilliant thanks v much Will reduce the pack down The springs are aftermarket - any recommendation of a trusted replacement that will be ok length wise?
it's a shame the Search engine on this Forum is so basic as dry clutch problems have been covered so many times now - non-std springs/pressure plate plus 'different' assembly of plates is nearly always to blame here. Hope you get it fixed.
Tbh in my case Chris the search engine doesnt help ( I did search - as well as looking up all sorts of tuning guides and manuals for stock / no-stock combinations) because I needed to understand the basic issue relating to the contact of the pressure plate onto the drum - seems its a combo of the pack being too thick and the springs maybe being too long! I am thinking that on the above, provided I get some better springs and reduce the pack a bit, job will be jobbed. Fingers crossed!
a lot of people fit aftermarket springs of a type that resist rusting but they are often a higher spring rate purely due to the material used. This will roughly cancel out the '4 spring only' mod used to reduce clutch lever effort. Aftermarket springs can also be of a thicker wire (for some reason best known to the supplier) which can result in a 'coilbound' situation as nelly already said.
You could check the spring cups to, did you use the old cups or buy new ? if so put them side by side and see if they are not so deep, this can give your springs the coilbound feel to. brian.
