Lithium Batteries - Safe Or Not?

What they omitted to say is, was an appropriate charger being used?

 

People are too thick to understand the differences. Thats what makes Li troublesome. The weakest link are the humans. It never ceases to surprise me how fucking stupid people are. Take today, I watched a moron roar up our hill whilst I walked to work. In snow and slush. Moments later I heard a crunch. Yup, fucker mounted kerb and crashed into fence after losing control in slippery and dodgy conditions. Honestly, people are truly thick as fuck.

 

When Lithium batteries first came to the market, I was flying RC electric helicopters and the batteries were contained in a soft plastic wrapper. Prominent in the instructions was a warning about swelling and always charging the battery in a special fire retardant bag. First saw hard case LiPo’s a while later when we were racing small electric cars indoors and club rules still required the same restriction. Perhaps it’s time to dig the old bags out again. Andy

 

Yeah…

And how often does this happen compared to, say, gas leaks or electrical shorts induced fires?

 

I agree, but can I also add that no one on this forum falls into this sweeping generalisation...this forum really is the exception to the rule..

 

There are a number of threads on here and elsewhere on this subject, which may be of interest to owners of bikes supplied with a Lithium based battery, and those considering changing from a conventional battery.
My Ducati came with a LiFePO4 battery and matching charger as standard (Skyrich), and while it works well generally, it's efficiency is adversely affected by cold weather and if allowed to discharge below a preset level may resist recharge even with its matching charger. This latter problem, and workarounds, have been discussed in an earlier thread on here:

https://www.ducatiforum.co.uk/threads/biketrac-killing-batteries.94511/ .

The links below are to information on options for Lithium batteries, and the claimed benefits for the LiFePO4 type, which may be of interest:

https://lithiumhub.com/lifepo4-batteries-what-they-are-and-why-theyre-the-best/#:~:text=The%20LiFePO4%20battery%20has%20the,fire%2C%20while%20LiFePO4%20does%20not ;

https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-216-summary-table-of-lithium-based-batteries ;

https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-205-types-of-lithium-ion .

Tom.

 

I personally stick to 'normal' batteries. The weight saving Li provides isnt something I can make use off anyway.

 

Think it’s only important in racing or pedal cycles. One you need to get as light as poss, it all counts, and the other means less load for the rider.
Otherwise, it’s simply bragging rights.

 

The weight saving is indeed fairly irrelevant for road use. But there’s quite a serious increase in CCA with Lithium vs other types of batteries. This changes a lot when cold starting a big twin. No hesitation anymore. All the better for sprag clutch and starter. But then you need to upgrade your charging system (r/r) and indeed use a specific battery tender, for safety.

 

I had a Shido LI one in my R1, it came with the bike, it was okay, CCA was only about 20amp more than stock though, and tbh at anything under around 10 degrees ambient it used to take ages to 'wake up'. Overall I'm not sure I'd bother tbh...

 

Really?

The 916 OEM Yuasa YB16AL-A2 is advertised at 210 CCA. The Skyrich HJT12B-FP I fit on mine is advertised at 260 CCA. That’s 25% more which makes a whole world of difference, especially with upgraded cables.

But I must admit, these Li batteries hate cold temps. You need to move south.

 

yeah, sorry, for context, the R1 has a 7AH battery as stock, so the LIPO was only able to deliver a little more, I know on some of the 12AH+ Applications the CCA difference can be MUCH bigger. I did find one manufacturer of battery that offered I think 180CCA which is a decent improvement, but the battery was £200 and needs a special charger specific to that battery manufacturer (to work with the BMS). It had a separate 'port' on it like a computer to plug the special charging system in. At this point I lost interest.

I believe the Panigale only has a 7AH, so wonder what the aftermarket versions of those can deliver...

 

If you're cold, long trousers would be better.

 

The OEM battery fitted to my Panigale R is an: HJT7B-FPZ-SC, there appears to have been 3 versions of the Ducati part # 39540411 /C, /D & /E, since 2016. I recently purchased a Ducati boxed /D version, which cost ~£180 delivered.
Links to the Details of the OEM battery are:
https://www.skyrichbattery.com/p9/Frequently-Asked-Questions/pages.html .
https://www.skyrichbattery.com/product_info.php?products_id=594 .
http://www.skyrichpower.com/pro.asp?id=66&g=en .

The details from the table in link # 3 are in the table below, which states it has a 4Ah capacity, and a CCA of 240A.


The charger details in the first link were sold by Ducati, but they now also market a version made by TechMate as in the second link:
https://www.skyrichbattery.com/Chargers/c11/p591/Lithium-Battery-Smart-Charger/product_info.html .
https://ducatistore.co.uk/shop/ducati-lithium-battery-charger-69929011ay.html .

Hope this is of interest.
Tom.
PS. Apparently charger for Panigale R and V4 only:
https://ducatistore.co.uk/shop/ducati-1299-panigale-charger.html .

 

Availability bias at large. How many non-catastrophic battery charging cycles do you hear about? Hearing about a plane crash doesn't increase the probability of being involved in one.

 

Lithium batteries. IME, store, use and charge them appropriately, if you install them in an older bike keep a check that the reg/rec is working correctly, and issues will be few and far between.
Worst battery accident I got close to was explosion of a standard lead-acid truck battery on charge when the hydrogen ignited on a spark when the charging lead was unclipped. Would have been life changing for the guy involved and 2 others in the area save for having the right first aid treatment to hand (Diphoterine)

 

Unless it’s always the same planes and that’s what you are travelling on

 

It’s also known that electric cars suffer in the cold (also from heater use) but the battery weight gains is probably outweighed by lockdown weight gain. As said above only relevant in racing. In my youth I would clad my bike in lighter carbon fibre spending loads when I would be better off wearing lighter gear or losing weight

 

Tbf not all weight is equal. A kilo on a bike can be far worse than a kilo on the rider.

But a kilo off the bike won’t beat 20gb off the rider