It's not so much "engine out" is it? Sort of " engine off". Without the engine there's suddenly no bike. Remarkable. Also when you look at the Pani without its fairing on, it seems to be particularly "full of stuff". There must be no end of things to go wrong on it.
So while I wait for the bike to transform from bits to a whole bike again I have been mulling over the whole weight v's power debate and started to do a bit of research and came up with some interesting data. The reason for doing this was simply to see if there is any real correlation between the weight of a bike and it's power and if there are noticeable tangible improvements in lap times and/or is there a tipping point where simply there is too much power for a bike below a certain weight. This data also could then relate to electronics and of course tyres. I picked the Honda RCV211 V as data on this was easily found from when motogp went four stroke. Listed below some highlights of what I found using Philip Island grid position lap time for the fastest Honda: Year: 2003; weight +145kg; Tank capacity 24L; Engine 990cc; BHP +200; lap time 1min.30.068 VR Year: 2006; weight +148kg; tank 22L; engine 990cc; BHP +240; lap time 1min.29.020 NH Year: 2007; weight +148kg; tank 21L; engine 800cc; BHP + 210; lap time 1min.29.201 DP Year: 2011; weight +150kg; tank 21L; engine 800cc; BHP + 210; lap time 1min.29.975 CS Year: 2012; weight +157kg; tank 21L; engine 1000cc; BHP +228; lap time 1min.29.623 CS Year: 2013; weight +160kg; tank 21L; engine 1000cc; BHP + 228; lap time 1min.28.120 MM I know stats can be construed to tell anything and i'm sure there will be difference of opinions here but for me some interesting things stand out here: Year 2006 we have the biggest power to weight ratio of the four stroke era and a lap time of 1.29 ish compared to year 2013 which has the heaviest bike but the lowest lap time to date and by almost 1 second - so in those 8 years of motogp and with all the changes, lap times lowered by nearly 1 second. You would have thought a bike of 148kg with +240bhp would have lapped quicker than a bike of 160kg and +228BHP. So you then ask yourself what other factors could attribute to this - electronics, tyres, rider and of course weather or does this data point towards a weight/power ratio happy medium? Maybe it is the rider? Well in 2013 the Yamaha was quickest with 1.27 so the argument of Marc Marquez is not valid. Maybe in 2006 the bikes were too powerful for the weight? It would be interesting to see the lap times of the 2006 bike with todays electronics….. Maybe the answer is a combination of good power to weight ratio AND electronics AND tyres…..seems to point that way. Interesting debate anyway.
great info dude... and your conclusion is spot on... it s the combined progress on all fronts... and don't take suspension out of the equasion... electronics ( drivablitiy ) + tires ( = drivability ) + suspension ( = drivability ) is where it all lays once you hit these outerwordly power/weight ratios...
Interesting. Progress over 10 years has been about 2.2% That's not exactly staggering, is it, when you consider all the time, expense and effort that has gone into it.
With more weight, less fuel = more time. Tyre tech, horsepower (+10%) and electronics =less time. Still would have expected more than 2 secs though.
Worth noting that they have been 'trying' to slow the bikes down over the last years to stop them outgrowing the circuits, including rev limits, engines having to last multiple races etc. Anyway, amazing thread, I can't believe i haven't seen it previously. Congrats, and interestingly when I was in MotoRapido 2 weeks ago having my bike remapped by Wilf there were 2 SL's, one without the fairings on in the workshop (was this your one?) and then one in the show-room. Wow.. keep us up to date, fascinating thread!! and I agree that MR really know what they are doing!
Hi Phil - thanks. They only started on my bike last Tuesday so the one you saw in show room would have been mine (nr 086). I will be there 29th July to see her in a nearly finished state and no, i'm not excited at all!
Just got this message from MR: shipping notice from italy just arrived.. showing: Rear Wheel 6.00x17" 6R Ducati WSBK '14 Front Wheel 3.50x17" 6R Ducati WSBK '14 M/Cyl 19x18 Brake - MotoGP Caliper - Radial Monobloc 30/34 - Pinless Nickel Ducati WSBK In the words of Hannibal "I love it when a plan comes together!".
^ SL wheels Marchesini magnesium. Wheels coming are OZ aluminium but same spec as on WSBK F14 and have little trick bits to them as from the factory bike - I prefer alu for track work and they are only 200g heavier but with the Pirelli slicks will be lighter overall. I also prefer the look of them.
Crank assembly happening today - if I lived near MR I would surely be the biggest pain the ass ever! Just love this stuff. It's great that a UK company can work wonders in engineering and also harness and develop modern developments in electronics. We should be proud of this and whilst MR like to keep a low profile, I for one am proud to be British, proud a British firm and mastermind is behind this project and by eck they deserve the praise!
^ track days (I am too old to race now); next season Dubai Autodrome will be doing track attack (timed laps - a bit like the old format superpole in WSBK) which could be fun.
Would it be better to start with a 1199RS than a SL? What is the price of an RS? Regarding ceramic coating the headers: I agree that you will get less radiant heat to the legs and will have less dense flow, thus, the exhaust scavenging can be improved. But, why do the world superbike teams and MotoGP DO NOT use it? I prefer to see the beautiful heated titanium color.
^ - good questions. - An RS is +120k Euro and only sold to race teams (I'm sure I could have got one though). - The SL has features on it the RS does not - magnesium frame/airbox as an example. - MR have been pioneering the use of ceramic coating on their race bike and claim it makes it big difference. I don't know why WSBK don't use it, but they do wrap part of the exhaust system. Moto GP did use inconel and assume they still do - hugely expensive but dissipates heat immediately and as light as a feather! - i'm with you in seeing the titanium! I'm not ceramic coating now, will leave the titanium pipe exposed but will wrap some of the less exposed.
Great. I thought that buying an RS with the SL crankshaft and frame was better, but I never asked Ducati for the RS price. I own a SL but I only changed the some plastic parts to carbon fibre. I was at Laguna Seca this past weekend and saw the SBK bike when they let me into their pits. They have changed the weight distribution completely. I saw that they wrap the exhaust only where it's too close to the rear tire. I wonder how the bike would handle with the Carbon-Sigl.com carbon frame/airbox, tank and rear subframe. I have never seen a review on these parts.
^ that is correct, they have completely changed weight distribution - the F12 had all the electronics in the nose cone - MR raced this bike; then last year as Ducati started their venture in WSBK they gradually started shifting things around so electronics went between tank and headstock and then they played around with fuel distribution so the tank they now have places more fuel actually under the seat. I think the great thing about the SL is the lightness of it all - and as they say, a virtual WSBK with lights on! Take all that off and you have a very light bike! If your gonna go carbon, i'd strongly advise you looking at fullsix - it's amazing stuff. I think sometime next week my bike will have their stuff on, so i'll post some pics before it goes for painting.
I am a ducati dealer in Mexico and actually our first fullsix order is on the way. I'll be waiting for those pictures.
