What a great ending to a great thread from a thoroughly nice bloke, I'm made up for you Kopey and wish you all the best with your pride and joy.
I'll try and dig pics out. Is have 999 on leathers a commonish thing in Holland? and yes looks like a darkie
Tx Peter! but she isn't finished yet! still 4 things to change /or put on and then engine development and setup... so about 80% done! but she's no girl anymore, she's a woman now! LOL!
Fantastic to see the bike finished and out there on the track. Spa must be some place! Great job with a great bike. Andy
The plans are stiil brewing on the tune .. And it s getting complicated. A combination of warrenty issues , current level of perfomance and.. Noise levels.. The warrenty issue has become all to real as a friend has blown his base engine to smithereens .. He s known to wring the engines neck but it was well mapped to make sure it got the right cooling at every rev range. Where as the engine was found to be running pritty lean at midrange.. Still it blew.. Prices for a new engine came in at 11k an 15k for an R ! So two things are to be asked : how close to the limit are we and what does it do to warranty as bungling it comes dearly.. Looking at where you can take it pritty easily, you get into superstock land very quickly and then the maintenace schedule changes from the stock one to a special race one.. Did the engine blow because that adaption hadn t been made ? We dont know .. Upping maintenace sounds costly as it means almost a rebuild of the engine .. then there is the news that the bigger airtubes do bring quit some extra oomph but at the cost of extra noise which will make trackdays even harder to get in to.. A lot is still to be found out on this so we ll have to develop in stages and wisely.. One thing that now is getting close te be a 'must have' is a better radiator capable of running the engine at the right temp. Coming in at spa without cooldown lap i noticed 104 c which is high .. And costs bhp and life so the plan looks like it s going to be : get the most out of it, check the impact on noise and see how far it goes .. The part i m really trying to get to is to get more power earlier and get rid of the dip.. then i ll bring the rev lim down to 11.250 to protect it .. To be continued ..
As far everything has been a doddle ... up till today... Had booked 2 days in Assen of which I had hoped for at least 6 sessions dry. As many know Assen is a oh so wonderfull track. Less sweeping and ultra highspeed as Francorchamps but with a name like the cathedral of speed, not exactly a Micky Mouse track… So of we went for two dryish and cold sessions with loads of particiapants crashing out ( at least 1 and up to three per session). Gino Rea from Moto 2 GP class was training and went down in his first lap out, just to say... Then just when I was geared up and ready to go for a smooth ride and some feeling planned with an increased DTC setting, daown cam just enough rain to spoil it all… so down went the afternoon sessions… grrr… But no harm done, today remained cool but dryish in the morning and the dat looked promissing . Day two saw an increase from first timers and as I had put myself in group 3, the plentiful first timers spilled over in that group. Just to indicate that there were plenty riders riding 3 abreast and I feared the tires cooling down in the 13 °c.. then one even crashed on a bad spot and the session was red flagged.. so 2 session down the day, no decent flowing lap was done… the 2:04 from session 1 from the day before still stood.. The organistion was so kind to let me move up a group and I really looked forward to the afternoon. Under a faint sunshine, the temps went up to the 19°c and all looked swell.. tires very warm, fuelled up, focussed on the task ahead and then : she wouldn’t start. Outdoing myself going through the motions I just learned, that was the final verdict.. decoupling the battery, putting her onto a loader, checking the loom, and the bypasses from clutch and sidestand, she would lit up, go over with vigour but no ignition. In the meantime, the track was at its absolute best and groups were having a great tracking day… I refused to calculate the cost per shitty lap I did just to keep it bearable.. packed up for the 300 km / 4hour drive home and reflected. Some decisions were taken on that journey. First to avoid being sidelined by rain: the 999 will be fitted with wets. It will also get a set of wheels carrying slicks so she can function as a spare bike and perhaps a quit bike should the big one fail sound tests. A set of a mates mag Marvic’s is on its way to the coaters to put them in black.. The RR is going to the dealer tomorrow and will get here mapping and tuning done in the meantime.. even if it blew a wonderful day, some insights were gained and action will be taken to make sure those mishaps will be avoided in the future.. Hmmm..come to think of it : wouldn’t that be nice… the 999 in a racesuit with the same RR livery …. Hmmm, now isn’t that something to look forward to…. By the way : Watching Gino Rea’s 2 man crew was pretty impressive with a spring change on the gas forks in just 8 minutes, fully dialled in..
There are always going to be niggles Kope. I'm sure it'll be sorted quickly and the weather is only going to get better. Taking a spare bike is a good plan. I have two bikes one wet/one dry. If nothing else its a rolling box of spares should I need to keep my primary machine going.
of course it will ... in the mean time learned to take the fairing of and where to look.. happy the toolkit is pritty complete now as i found out through 5 fellow box users that i was able to help... i'm getting handier by the day !
EBC while riding only some laps at Assen, something i did change was the ABC ( from 1 to 2). this is not some fancy but onnoticable gimmick... while session 1 felt pritty unsmooth and jerky, the switch transferred the behaviour. the difference is that much that taking some ongoing corners were much faster and significant less throtle input was required.. it also changed the way to brake with more room/need for trail braking.. the bike is so stunningly flickable that it needs this smoothness when rolling into the corners and bends. as the engine brake will definatly draw it to the inside of the corner by itself.. engine / power delevery The first dyno's are planned for next week. to fix a base to start on. Something good to know: there have been 4 or 5 cases of non R engines been blown up in Europe. All of them had been pushed and tweeked to get the last bhp out of them. It has been noticed that when adding whatsoever as to motormanagement annuls the warranty. Changing timing and/or doing track riding only (racing or trackdays) changes the maintance schedule from 24K to 5 k for the base engine and 7 or 8 for the stronger ( Ti parts) R engine. the first Base engines only came with 165 rwhp and all the mappingsupdate now bring them to 188 . this is the devlopment that Ducati itself has done to manage the reliablity of its engines. the 1200 can be pushed to 210 but at the cost of becoming very fragile. It will take some fancy internals everywhere to make it reliable at those levels and here we're in captain kirk or Alstare territory .. a mods schedule in now in place just to aim to bring more bhp lower down and then to top it of at 11k-ish revs.. it will be: 1.Put out a base settings (Evo termi + MWR filter) 2. Make sure the airduct is fully sealed so air goes in smoothly and nonvortexed.. 3. Open up the air intake in the front fairing by grinding out the nose - redo the dyno 4. Add a larger and straighter airduct - open up the nose fairing even further to match the larger airduct - redo the dyno 5. Change the timing of the cam's - redo the dyno 6. Add the Rapidbike to bring some balance if needed - redo the dyno.. then decide on what to do: remove the Rapidbike? top it of at 11.5 revs to save it from revving its head of? interesting times ahead.. __________________ Now we know what we want ( more oomphh lower in the rev range ) the Termi PRO manifold jumps to the fore! giving 18bhp more between 6,5K and 9,5K sounds exactly what we want, isn't it? the max power goes on but it hits 200 bhp at 10,5K ... so... just need to see what we can do between 4 and 6,5 and we're done, without having to wring it's neck every time we go out...
i just ordered the PRO manifold.. that is not in stock in Italy, so i wonder when i'll get it! now i'll have to prepare the 999R, must throuroghly review the budgetplanning... at least i'll be assured i can ride everywhere and Always...
so : news got in that the first din dyno run with EVO tube/system and MWR filter and standard EVO map yielded 192 rwhp measured in din.. i should know SAE reults tomorrow. More significant was that this is 10BHP more then the Base with same pipe/system and filter... this week should see the timing done and a new dyno will be done... with timing and Pro pipe, we could be heading for 200 bhp+ at the RW ... not bad my mates have upgraded to the R as well and one did pull the 1000km in 2 days and once did 300kmh with 1000 revs to go... we're sort of negotiating a servicescheme / maintenance agreement to keep the warranty on the R in track conditions... interesting times i ll post the chart asap !
View attachment 16412 this is the SAE dyno chart showing 187 at the rears wheel. the setup is the TERMI EVO line with standard EVO map and with a MWR filter we're waiting for the PRO manifild to come in end of june to do the further development. Rulours go that for dedicated track use, Ducati is working on a maintenance schedule that, if kept to, should keep warranty intact. any use of aftermarket enginekit or motormanagement would make this warranty nul and void. to allow for customers to check on the maps they are given, apparantly some further mapping development is under way as well. Seems like Ducati knows the R will be run on track a lot and want to do a proper job getting het engines fueling correct.. from looking at the chart, the dip between 5 and 7 really shows and at Assen, moren then at Spa , you could feel it. as more corners just dip into that rev range..
Mettet – Ride report R and S1000RR When it comes to tracks, where we live, Spa stands out much byond what the world has to offer in general. And the there Zolder and the mini track Mettet. Very much a stop and go track where almost most turns are tight to very tight. Apart from the straight and one 192 kph sweaper, it’s a second and third gear occasion. Where a well ridden Supersport can run with the litre bikes easily.. so not exactly the preffered track for the R.. But with the new BBS installed and many tight corner exits, a good test track for the occasion. And finally get a little more aggressive on the brakes. And , a mate of mine is an instructor for the BMW test experience so I could finish the day with a session on the 1000RR to topple it up.. An excellent opportunity to be able to get a first hand feel of this much acclaimed monster . Would it be really as good as everybody seems to find it? Furthermore, there would be optimal weather conditions. some sun but not too hot.. First session was still a damp occasion so it was rather slow going. But still a good 20 minutes to find out on the track. On slicks it was good to see that even in the damp that the slicks gave considerably more grip and traction then I thought there would have been. I thought the yellow light would be on all the time but it wasn’t. not once did it come on.. something that made me wonder.. Having just done Spa and Assen, 2 of the most endearing bike tracks around.. Mettet proved midget and difficult. And hard to overtake. But as they had dropped me in the fastest group pace was good so no moving chicanes to navigate. As said, the intention was to find out about braking and so we upped that work. Braking harder and harder and then later and later. Just to find out that with the setup , it was not hard at all to start outbraking almost every groupmember. The magic came when it was clear that it is not that hard to brake deep into the corner with monstrous bite and still loads of feel coming from the 2 finger pressure. Me still being an all geared up 97 kg occasion, it also showed the adagio that weight ( or the lack of it) outperforms power. Totalling less the 290kg it helped to get the overhand on combo’ where the rider weighs 25kg lighter. It also revealed that the forks will take some setup as some dribble did show. Monday the bike is going in with EMC² , our very knowledgable Ohlins man who advises top teams in IDM and endurance racing on geometry, setup and telemetry… apart from removing the DES on the rear shock, correct spring settings, valving and oil level, the aim to have a full weightbalance based setup is what sould come out of it… and once this basic setup will be done, then it will just be some small adjustments per track.. As the track dried up, lap times came down and even though it never felt like it, I was able to maintain myself in the better half of fast group with a best of 1:14 where as good riders rarely get it below 1:12 … again, that time never felt as if it was a quick time and this for 1 main reaon : the dip between 5 and 8k revs.. the infamous dip. I son’t think there is a track where it can be felt better.. Let it be said : The R sort of pronounces this dip. Another mate LJ brought his fully setup R to the track for the first time and noticed this as well. He just had traded in his base bike for the R. But this bike had been mapped to get 198 bhp but mainly a much smoother way to get there, almost dialling out the dip. So using the corners to gain tens of metres on other, and being able to get a good exit spot, the lag of pickup getting out of it was rather frustrating. R1’s and RR got away that couple of meters to be reeled in just to late to go for a clean outbraking… It also made gear choice an unhappy thing. 3rd would get you lower in the rev range, prononciating the dip but second would get is so agressivly that you’ld be on the rearwheel at every corner you come out of… because let this be clear, once above 7,5 it really packs a tremendous punch.. a punch that comes in extremely quickly , almost 2 stroke like.. it will power wheelie in second and third even with me all over the tank.. use the QS quickly becomes part of the must do’s when riding it.. When discussing all this with LJ, we came to the conclusion that the Pro pipe should be able to resolve most of this grief and that it will have a tremendous effect on the bike will ride.. as discussed earlier, much of the dip can be dialled out using a rapidbike module and some decent mapping, but Ducati having taken a firm stand on aftermarket enginemanagement systems cancelling out warranty, we now await the pro pipe eagerly as this should be the key to getting our goal, getting more power and grunt earlier. There is news of the first ones being delivered now, so end of this month should be good. The last session of the day was used to push it a bit further, but the best time remaind 1:14:22 .. The bike got all packed up and then there was the test of the beemer still to go.. they were stock models and tires so the basic package straight out of the dealers showroom.. Even on the first lap , it was clear immediately why this is probably the most sensible superbike to have. Of course it’s not as nimble as the Pani, especially in the track weapon version it is now, but for the rest, there is really nothing to be faulted. It does everything so well it is eerie… perhaps already being accustomed to the bang effect of the pani, the silky, rubberband power delivery doesn’t make it feel like the powerexplosion that it is said to have. Or perhaps it the the very good wind protection but the power is so smooth the straight are very relaxing.. not so on the pani as the smaller bubble makes you live every yard intensely… but then again the difference with how to get out of the corners was very noticeable and less troublesome. The Beemer does what is is said to do. It makes it all look like so easy.. we were going fast as of lap 2 with no worries whatsoever.. but due to the Bridgestones street tires, fast was a lot slower than fast on slicks as almost the whole group overtook us. Which was not the case on the Pani, where only 3 locals ran considerably faster. Again I saw no reason to change from Pirelli. The tires were good but not impressively. When getting out of a corner when I tad to well, she stepped out at the rear and that was like the signal to call it a day… The stepping out did have a sobering effect but also showed the fact that TCS is not a “idiot proof” – insurance. I still have to come to terms with what it does when and it now even got me thinking of my TCS module was working at all. The rear would move gently but it never saw the light go on once .. and then there was the “unknown device” error message… so perhaps it isn’t activated yet, even though the lights on settings did work now, where it didn’t before the BBS settings activation job that was done this week. So now a busy project week ahead : going to the Ohlins guru, picking up the painted carbon seat unit and hopefully the 999 racing front fairing. Getting the 999 track-ready with a racing bracketholder and the fairing and installing the GPS timer module. So both bikes should be at their very best when turning up at Donington, Cadwell and Brands the week after… I regard those days as what should be a highlight of the year. We incorporated a stopover at Motorapido in the south to go see their SSTK ans BSB bikes and learn a lot on what can be done on throttle respons and settings. I’m sure that, having been indepently developping the pani for almost 2 years now, they have a wealth of knowhow that may outreach even ducatis in some fields… I’m truly counting the days and can’t wait to ride those tracks and meet up with some of you. I was able to persuade LJ to come along so the guy to whom I owe the greatest respect for giving me this marvel will be there as well. also some pics of the family reunion whe i got back.. PS : I’m over the moon with the SR1 from Shubert… light, flexible , extremely well vented, great fit and stability, no uplift whatsoever.. top piece of kit..
I gonna throw the cat amongst the pigeons here, but I think the 999 is the best looking out of the 3. That design is really growing on me!
Be interesting to see what times get banged in at Brands and Cadwell. Can their not map the fuelling blip out? My Evo had the same and CJS mapped nearly all of it out and its smooth as hell now, and on my monster with a PC they dialled it all out.
There are sounds that they migth do so once a dyno is pulled. so there would be a sort of DP approved 'custom map' for the R loaded whilst avoiding having to use the rapidbike module as they won't allow it if you want to keep warranty.. i'm not out to set new lap records...
