I got married in the early 70's and brought up my family then, yes the "winter of discontent" was rough but not as bad as the havoc and destruction i experienced with the most evil country leader in Thatcher we have ever had in my opinion. Labour through and through yes till the day i die can't understand why anybody who has to get up all hours of the day to put food on a plate and keep a roof over their head believing in any other politics.
But like most labourites you still don't get it, you only get people like thatcher AFTER labour have fucked it up. Labour spends all the grand kids and grandkids grandkids money and the truth behind the promises reveals itself. Then the tories come in and cut everything back, everything, to try and pay the bills.As long as we are in that cycle of Labour making promises we can't afford and then the tories having to clear up so look like the nasty party, nothing will change. The tories are not the problem, they are a consequence of labours actions.
Not true once again Tories are the problem not even electable now, agreed ? Secondly the fickle minded electorate with no political allegiance, fence sitters, bend with wind through greed with issues that only affect them personally.
I would certainly not put the current tory government as a benchmark of how to do it well but again, who did they follow and what state did they leave it in? Again, followed labour who cleared out all the cash. The cycle is there to see for those with an open mind.
My political history is not good, how did Thatcher 'correct' what Labour had done ? I only remember things like selling off council houses, stopping free milk in schools, Poll Tax and didn't she start the ball rolling for privatisation of NHS etc ? From memory she had a reputation that any factory she visited closed down shortly after too.
they pumped 1trill of oil money into the south east. yet we have more debt than ever . will giving the wealthiest another 10bill tax cut partly funded by an increase in NI contributions sort out the uk? . i dont roll with the, i'm a labour / tory man through and through either. scotland and wales should be the obvious go to refference point when you get decades of labour hegmony that needs to secure the votes of elsewhere to get into power. labour where the original home rule party. now they only manage disapointment rather than tackle it. two party fptp politics have fucked the UK. its always us and them from both sides. tho i do beleive Tory electionering is by far and away the worst when it comes to deviding the UK
Look up the winter of our discontent, Thatcher was a consequence of the previous labour governments abilities or lack of them. You didn't have died in the wool labourites voting for her because Labour was doing okay.
These last few posts are why imo, you can never truly argue politics. For what Portboy grew up with (I assume) his views are set & he won’t be persuaded otherwise. That’s fair enough, I agree with @noobie & the evidence to my eyes is there time & time again. Labour spend, Tory save is a generally accurate rule of thumb since the dawn of time. Labour even joked about it when they last left office. Thatcher got a lot wrong as do all incumbent PMs but she’s the past now. In more recent times, if Gordon Brown hadn’t blown all my pension pot & sold the country’s gold reserves off to prop up his schoolboy economics, I suspect Labour would still be in power now but he did & austerity was the price. As noobie says, that just plays out as the tories being the nasty party rather than necessary (at the time) party. Time for another change now though but not with comrade Corbyn at the helm. gawd help us all,
I will. I'm trying to see how she corrected what had been done before, other than things were bad under Labour so people voted Tory. (John Steinbeck is one of my favourite authors by the way)
Along those lines, I have wondered in the past whether the ideal would be 5 years of Labour then 5 years of Tories - so neither party has long enough to 'ruin' the country
By growing the economy to create an increase in revenue for the Government whilst keeping the same [Or preferably lower] tax rates.
Labour highlighted why the link between unions and party were always going to lead to this. In the 60's and 70's the unions funded and basically were the power behind the sword of labour so to speak. So when Labour got into power, it wasn't unusual for the unions, sometimes as one group or creating a linked and multiple attack on a labour government of, do as you are told or we will bring you and the country to it's knees, and they did, often. British leyland, train services, local councils, refuse collections are just a few to search to see how things were. Some are trying to take the discussion onto present day to avoid the subject itself, make no bones about it however, thatcher was a consequence of the winter of our discontent and the government of the day that was labour.
To widen your reading, take a look at the three-day-week and the union attempts to bring down the Conservative Heath Government in 1973.
I'm fully aware of the 3 day week and how unions had attempted to be the government de facto by bringing the country to it's knee's. This is why most prime ministers cowed down to the unions until they ran into Thatcher who sought to remind them that a government elected by the people ran the country and not union members and the union bosses. I look at the british car industry and remember longbridge where the union reps said striking will not close this plant, sure enough.... I thought we were concentrating on Thatcher but hey, I'm game for a new thread in Speakers
@noobie said “Some are trying to take the discussion onto present day to avoid the subject itself, make no bones about it however, thatcher was a consequence of the winter of our discontent and the government of the day that was labour” If that’s at me noobie, I was doing so to illustrate your point about the cycle of labour spend & Tory clean ups Certainly not trying to avoid the subject itself. Thatcher was a necessary consequence of Labours policies, union domination of the party & the terrible winter of discontent, three day weeks & ill thought out public spending on failing industry. She got a fair bit wrong herself though.
raising debt and relying on future growth to pay it back along with trickle down ecconomics has been proven not to work. time and time again.
