I don't believe a no deal Brexit is inevitable. We must remember the draft deal on the table is not about the UK's future trading relationship with the EU but about the terms under which we divorce, i.e. 'we'll extend the transition period so we can agree future trading arrangements; you don't mess about with our nationals in your country and we won't mess about with yours; the trading status quo will remain as is during the transition period.' We shouldn't get hung about the NI/Republic border issue too much, it's just a card being played by the EU. This is like a divorce. At present we're at the decree nisi stage i.e we agree to divorce, we just need to settle the other bits before we get the decree absolute. Despite all the shouting and jumping up and down in parliament and on various interviews, I genuinely believe at the end of the day the draft withdrawal agreement will get passed. The alternative is too damaging to the world's 5th largest economy for any MP to seriously consider. Admittedly IMO this damage will be short-term, say 1-3 years, and the UK will get over it, but it will be incredibly damaging none the less. As for the 'we can't leave unless the EU say we can' realistically that's nonsense. (I know you didn't state that @noobie but another thread below your one did). That's what the agreement may say but who's to say it has to be adhered to? Say, for the sake of argument, the EU refuse to agree terms with the UK to leave at the end of the transition period, there is absolutely nothing to stop the UK leaving. So sue me! It'll probably be a different government by then and it'll take years for anything to be settled in any court be it ECJ or UK Supreme. Meanwhile the UK's out and getting on with it's business. How many times in the past have governments around the world agreed one thing then ended up doing another?
I made that statement, because this what all the fuss is about. We are (trying) to leave legally at the moment, and look at the resistance. Can you imagine the establishment trying to leave illegally, it'll never happen. That clause is all about making sure we never leave. It's naïve to think otherwise.
We simply won’t be able to leave illegally. No country would ever deal with us. And that’s the issue it would seem.
The draft agreement can be dealt with in one of two ways at the end of the period. We can apply for a time extension of the arrangement, where we will be obliged to pay proper cash money to the EU for the privilege. Or we hit the backstop. And all that this entails. Our choice. So, pay the money to extend the temporary arrangement, or move to backstop until such time as both the UK and the EU agree to end it and move on. Yeah, the EU agreeing to end it. Trust them, they are on our side. How anyone, anyone at all, cannot see this draft agreement for the madness it represents, is beyond me. I feel entirely confident in saying that May dreamt it up in order to ensure, when the draft is inevitably rejected, one of two outcomes - Brexit is "somehow" cancelled, or we leave without a deal. The past two years have been so insane that I genuinely don't know which of the two alternatives May is steering us towards.
Some have been saying, myself included, it was the eu's intent all along to spend 2 years fucking us about so at the last minute give something that no nation could accept. They would have known there was no way we would accept being tied into europe with no end date and no way of getting out of that "temporary" agreement. Never mind
Thank fook, not a macem. They were 1st to vote out!(Nissan..lol) Missing the point (deliberately?) that the vast majority of well off Brexiteers will continue to have freedom of movement after Brexit. As usual it will be average Joe that has restrictions after. It doesnt bother you and a few others, thats fine. Laughed though at headlines that came up the other day on nees search ''outrage, Brits will need visa to visit Europe'' bloody EU again eh? Crazy drunken bstads. It will make NO difference to the well off....
Be honest, in regards to brexit, which side do you think had the most multinationals and millionaires pushing their side, remain or leave? as to freedom of movement..tut..https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2018...e-travel-to-europe-after-brexit/#.W-8z-IH7TnE
And ironic tbh if acceptable to Brexiteers. Never mind, all those immigrants at Calais (where are they these days in the news...) they dont have passports anyway.
I had to show my passport the last time I went to France. Last year, it was. Will I still have to show it after we leave the EU?
I disagree, except the bit about two years of insanity. I don't see Brexit being cancelled, much as I'd like it, but there would need to be evidence of a huge shift in public opinion - I just don't see it even with my rosiest of rose tinted remain spectacles on. Leave without a deal has felt like the real danger, now that Rees Mogg and the ERG have played the only card they have we will see. But it's increasingly looking like TM will hang on, in which case the only outcome will be this withdrawal deal and the single customs territory will become semi permanent - until public opinion in the UK shifts one way or the other.
You do though see the real danger of the perpetual interim arrangement, don't you? Are you not troubled by it?
