Thanks for all the replies guys... Aha - yes I have to admit slow speed tight corners aren't my forte, ime they always seem to be urban and oil/diesel soaked, so I always feel I'm thrupenny biting them. Both my bikes are fitted with Renthal Superbike Ultra Low Rise bars which are pretty flat & wide and these probably compound the trepidation I have with the above. Will endeavour to practice... every day is a learning day.
Thirty-odd years ago I used to commute to work in rural shropshire on my Honda TL150 trials bike and I used to experiment with countersteering on one particular righthand bend. Approaching the bend flat out in fifth gear (only 55mph with the 60 tooth rear sprocket on) I would sit on my left hand so that it could play no part in the proceedings. My right hand would have the fingers outstretched and with the throttle only gripped in the crook between the base of thumb and forefinger such that I could just about hold the throttle open but could only push on the righthand bar (attempting to pull on the bar would simply lift my hand away). In other words I could not turn the bars to the right, only to the left .. ie I could only countersteer round the righthander .. anything else was pretty much physically impossible. I took that bend flat out under one-handed countersteer five days a week all through that summer (sporting a daft grin). Wide Renthall trials bars too. In fact, I still have the same bars which are now fitted to my pushbike and yes, I countersteer that too. I dispute the notion that it only works above certain speeds. It seems to work just the same on my pushbike even when going as slow as possible. These days on the monster, I use both pushing and pulling on the bars to (counter)steer. I've not quite worked out why but I tend to push to turn into the bend but pull more on exit ... in a counter direction of course. And just to clear up a rogue point ... When discussing this subject it is sometimes suggested or implied that there are two types of steering, namely "normal" and "counter". This is almost entirely incorrect. Once on the move ALL steering via the handlebars is countersteering. There is no "normal". The only time normal steering works is when you're pushing the bike around in the shed.
Yeah... that confused me also. Especially as a later post showed a video of counter steering a pushbike at walking pace. There was a comment that mention the tyre size so I sortov thought this may have some bearing.
It becomes such a natural thing to do that I'd have to actually try riding a bike at walking pace to see if I do it or not at that speed. Without actually trying it I remain convinced that in something like a CBT riding around cones situation I'd be wobbling around steering in the direction I want to go. Note I avoided calling it steering the 'correct' or 'Right' way. Might have to find a car park over the weekend and see what happens. I'm also going to have to try and find the reference to it in the book I mentioned earlier in this thread. I'm sure others will be interested in what the great Wayne Gardner had to say about it. Yes I still have the book, all books are treasure. And yes we have a house bursting at the seams with books of all descriptions.
I taught my first child to ride her tiny pushbike by counter-steering it for her! Sharp taps on the bars from me made her stay upright and she learned... Without subtle counter-steering, all bikes will fall over when in motion.
Day 1 I was running into T4 at Almeria too hot and I was going to run out of track. So I followed Rule 3 - Push the bar. I pushed the bar and turned tighter and made it round the corner with room to spare. FYI Rule 1 = trust your tyres, Rule 2 = breathe Rules thnx to Wee Eck (Alex). I began pushin the bar more consciously and Im now in inters.
Re trust your tyres...if you have grip to brake, you have grip to lean further. More useful on the road !
it’s not that it only works above that speed: it’s that the imho way you can turn us using it above that speed. You won’t likely be counter steering much at 3mph weaving thru traffic, but if your doing tight turns at super low speed you probably will.
The speed transition will vary depending on bike weight, tyre profile etc. if you sit bolt upright and are doing say 5mph on the streetfighter it's going to want to follow the bars. If you "lean" into the turn That's the ticket... it's not one thing... it's about body position. I was always taught to point into the corner with your elbow, push it down and forward.. it tips the body around, moves the hips, and coincidentally counter-steers the bars... Doesn't really feel obvious on the SF, but on the 996 it makes perfect sense...
I was watching my wife getting her Monster out of the garage to go to work this morning and maneuvering it at very low speed in front of the house. There was zero counter steering involved at walking speed. Just turning the bars in the direction wanted. No gyroscopic effect at very low speeds…
Exactly. If you look at the gymkata stuff (or whatever it’s called) even with aggressive changes of direction the shell is still steered with and not against the corner.
I don't know what's more impressive - the motorcycle control or the amount & complexity of the cone layout.
If he was any good at it he would have shot three suspects and a couple of innocent bystanders...whilst doing the course !
I went out for a biff on the old Darmah and had a go at this counter steering lark. One thing I immediately noticed when consciously counter steering is that it doesn't take much input to get a reaction from the bike and the reaction is pretty instant. Plus as mentioned above it allows a much tighter controlled line to be taken. With my new found er... skills I approached my favourite roundabout, the one I usually have a couple of laps of before peeling off into town, and gave a farty push on the right bar and pow down he went to a lovely low lean and round we go accompanied by suitable chortling. It then came to peel off and I got monetarily confused... err which bar end do I push because it instinctively didn't seem safe to push the left bar when cranked over to the right. At this point I defaulted to not thinking about it and bingo we peeled off fine... So how do you flip from side to side using counter steering e.g through a chicane?
Push left to go right then hard right to go left. Or vice versa. But not too hard or the front wheel can do strange things. Going back to earlier comments, you 100% steer into slow corners the direction you are going, and then as gyroscopic forces increase then counter steering occurs. Can't remember being taught this back in the 70s so I guess its an instinct thing
