Counter Steering?

Teaching myself over a winter the whole twist of the wrist thing took me from being lapped to winning races. It’s amazing how hard you can turn and therefore how late you can turn. That and using knees/hips to force the weight directional change in chicanes was amazing.

I have had a few low sides at lower speed this and am fairly convinced it’s because I steered so hard and fast. Watching friends always said I turned later and harder (as spectators) than the other guys

 

Correct. I would be moving my bum to the left too. Pushing the left pegs as I go - it all moves the bike over and then leans it left.

 

Yes. Along with the left peg and ‘shove’ your knee an hard into the lhs of the tank. Imagine kneeing a mate to give him a dead leg

Of you see the GP boys on quick changes in chicane there is often gap under the front wheel from the force because they are really using body weight to change direction as much as bars.

 

Counter steering is a destabilising moment required to initiate turning by initiating the lean into the corner. Once the lean has started you may need to steer into the corner to set a steady speed through a turn, depending on the speed and radius of curvature. The guy on the police bike is still subtly applying countersteer (out of turn) before he steers into the turn.

 

Counter-steering is the same technique as rally drivers use to corner fast on loose surfaces.
Watch any racers these days and the hard front braking unsettles the rear add a dab of brake that forces it out keeping the front more upright, stable and grippy to then turn faster and gas out before the leaning technique has reached the apex.
Supermoto or dirt track is the way to learn this effectively.

 

Great book, really insightful. Read it about 30 years ago, my girlfriend at the time was pissed off that I'd asked her to buy it as a present...

 

I hate to be negative but I disagree ... in a friendly manner of course.
Countersteering to initiate a turn is entirely different to the practice of steering into a skid as the back wheel breaks loose.
Countersteering doesn't actually involve physically turning the bars in the wrong direction (bear with me) it just requires a force (turning moment) to be applied at the bars. The bars don't actually move in the contra direction at all but instead the force induces a gyroscopic precession reaction at the front wheel which causes it (and hence the bike) to lean into the turn.
On the other hand, when backing into a turn supermoto style, the turn has already been initiated and subsequently the bars do actually turn in the contra direction but this is to control the skidding rear wheel rather than to cause the bike to turn. Its not so much countersteering, more like counter-turning to control a loose rear end.
And rally drivers cannot use true countersteering at all since a rally car is not a single-track vehicle and hence the wheels cannot lean into a turn under gyroscopic precession.

An interesting insight into how precession works can be experienced using a bicycle wheel (the older type with an integral spindle).
Hold the ends of the spindle loosely and spin the wheel in the direction it would turn during forward motion. Then try to turn the spinning wheel to the left or right. If you are holding the spindle loosely enough (important) you will see and feel the wheel banking over in the opposite direction to the intended turn.
You will also note that this banking action is instantaneous .. the wheel does not first turn in the correct direction and then bank over as a result but rather, as I said earlier, the applied turning force (moment) immediately and directly translates into a leaning over due to the gyroscopic precession mechanism.

Or try the "sitting on your left hand" experiment that I described earlier (carefully though, on a quiet road) ... and watch the bars.
They do not actually turn at all. The bike leans as a direct and immediate response to the applied turning force.

Of course both techniques are used by bike racers of all sorts, from todays supermoto pilots right back to the "rear wheel steering" of Kenny Roberts and others back in the 70's (and others no doubt).
But the two techniques are different .. even though the same words can be used to describe either.

Hope that 1) makes sense.
2) is helpful.
and 3) is humble.

 

I see what you are saying, but in practice I have a different experience.

I have just spent the weekend at Misano watching WSBK, then yesterday got on the track myself. I also did four days at Supermotoland in January and March.
There, we learnt to hit the brakes hard and late just before the turn (stoppies) to elevate the rear wheel. Then we were taught to drop a gear as we hit the brakes, then the rear wheel loses grip, but remains on the track. Then repeat, but start the turn, inside leg out (Moto-X style), rear wheel now outside the turn (maybe a dab of brake assists), front wheel more upright, not on the side, still hard on the brakes. Then, when the inside bar pressure stops pushing back, hit the gas. The rear is pointing in the right direction for exit, the front unloads and is now “straight” attitude to the rear.
So, in all of that there was no countersteer, there is no turning moment at the bars, just massive brake force and lean, the rear is skidding, therefore the bars must be pointing in the opposite direction and the rider is hanging off causing the lean.

I am just recounting learned practice and observation. I might have some slo-mos to illustrate.

I’ll let you know how I get on at Mugello next week.