If I remember correctly (probably not - it was a long time ago) from my O Level history, the NI thing came about because some king (could have bee a James) handed over large bits of Ireland in the north to Protestant Scots for services rendered. So they were interlopers, of a different religion and from a different place. They then went out of their way to be obnoxious to the Catholics. It was hardly surprising that such a situation bred resentment and violence. The religion was the easy badge to differentiate the haves and the have nots. There were religious wars in Switzerland, back in the day, between Catholics and Protestants. But now that everyone has money, no one is much bothered about these divides any more. There are Catholic cantons and Protestant cantons. Some of the holidays and traditions are different. The churches look different. There are even Protestant and Catholic villages here, in a Protestant canton. It's typical of the Swiss mish-mash. But you'll find that money performs the same function in society as oil in your Ducati. Just so long as it's flowing freely.
which was sort of my point.. the interlopers were proddies persecuting the catholics... and as you mention, as long as the money keeps flowing , everyone is happy, which was my point about parity in society.
Hopefully this link will work, why can't our politicians speak out like this? http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151925108569535
Has anyone ever seen the Ricky Gervais film "The Invention of Lying"? I think everyone should see this film. It may just put religion into perspective.
Picture the scene. Your life is falling apart, you have a drugs problem and see no way to turn yourself from crime or an early death. Then you hear/see/experience something. It grabs your attention. Like a light going on. It seems to give you hope. Faith you can get better. You can clean up. You can be a good person, hold down a job, be a valued asset to society. Personally, who am I to tell those people its all tosh, they are worthless and to go die in a gutter because God in whatever form doesn't exist? Back on thread. RIP to a brave soldier who served his time for queen, country and causes which were not his to fight.
if you were so verminous to tell someone that they were worthless and to go and die in the gutter then that makes you a scumbag...if you were in a theological discussion with that person and expressed a contrary view then thats just a difference of opinion..if however, you barge in uninvited, like a Jehovhas Witness knocking at the door then thats simply ignorant.. should a person find comfort in an invisible wizard then thats up to them, its doesnt make it true or valid in the wider sense, its simply their opinion without evidence, at a time when they are desperate and not thinking clearly..presumably because of their drug habit or inner need to find meaning in something... hope is better than nothing, even if its a mistaken belief in the vacuous or absurd or they saw jesus in a cloud or slice of burnt toast.... either way, at some point, however you cut it, that person has to make the decision to get well, and no amount of praying is going to help...they get better with sheer guts, determination and the help of others, if they cant do it without a delusion that lights the blue touch paper thats fine as long as they get better, contribute to society and dont start trying to convert people to the ultimate 'truth'.. Most addicts get better with the help of medical care, not a god.
You need to take the blinkers off mate, its spoiling your view of a wider world where people are perfect but their lives aren't. Not all religious people are maniacs or delusional idiots and many find great comfort in their faith. So much so, they have nothing left if its taken away. And not take comments so literally I am a fence sitter on religion generally coz you never know ;-)
I'm proper fed up... I wrongly said I was surprised at the 20min response. ( seen very fast response in Croydon and here). But the first call in ( because the car hit the poor chap ) was it was an RTA so now I understand. What makes me really mad is once again these nutters where on the radar !!!!! Filmed at a gathering while their " leader" was preaching hate. And we're known. As where the Boston Bombers who had been flagged up. Sorry but do we watch them for 6 years???? Or do we step in and stamp this out? I'm sorry but if I went out in my road and started shouting stuff about a group of people or minority I'd be arrested and banged up surely under hate crime or something???? So please explain why these fundamentalists are allowed to do this? If they are known to be converting others to hatred and to insight crimes . Why is this not acted on or stamped out? Why do we watch people for 6 years? This is the problem when they come up on the radar it needs to be dealt with as soon as we have proof. Look at all the hasstle we have removing them from the country !!!!! Sorry we need to act faster and harder. We have become an easy touch.
Due to my own, probably wrong, initial assumption Yets. It was wrong of me to assume that his house was funded by you and me and I apologise if this narrow minded assumptio has offended you.. Now I have had time to reflect, I realise that his house was most likely funded by collections and donations from whatever extremist religious group he belongs to. Im sure we will find out the truth in due course.
Yep, lets arrest anyone who has an inkling of being a risk to anyone. Any email or comment on the internet. Any book bought. Any muslim travelling to the middle east or asia. Lock em up or deport them if not British. Sure they have not actually committed a crime, but they will, right? And peolpe are getting het up about two blokes signing a bit of paper in an old dustry rectory?! Our civil liberties have been eroded so much over the last 20 years, with more to come, this is the kind of thing I thick wod be classed as an overreaction
Thing is, God is a good placebo effect for many. When you get the placebo, it can't make you better, containing no active substances, but it does, because your mind cures yourself. Religion is the same for some - gives them the extra energy they need to turn their lives around. The fact that there is no sky wizard matters not a jot in this process. And maybe, when they have all their strength back, they can "get off the drugs" and realise that there is no big man in the sky. It is a bit bleak for many to face up to a death knowing that "that was it". That's why I don't say RIP when someone dies. What's the point? In my view, their life has come to an end, they have ceased to be. There is no more of them in their body than there is a cow's spirit in your joint of brisket. So believing fairy tales does help some people get through the day (or their life).
I agree if a person is preaching hate or associating with these people it should be acted upon. We can't lock them all away but the authorities should be making them aware they are being watched and if they continue then action should be taken and if these people aren't British then they should be shown out of the country, sorry but that's my opinion and I don't think it's unfair. Did anyone see the video of the march in Luton with hundreds of Muslims chanting "British police burn in hell" this should not be allowed.
Would this have happened had the religious hate preachers , preaching on OUR streets, been dealt with and deported swiftly? Would this have happened had our immigration policy been anything other than a joke? We have had years of Left wing open policies and we will pay the price. Anyone entering the UK should be a guest. If they are prepared to integrate and put something into society, all well and good and they should be embraced. If they have arrived here to preach hatred or make a living from the generous state benefits or criminal activity then they should be hoofed out on the next available transport.
