I don't want to ride a bike with horsepower I don't want to use. I want to ride within a reasonable percentage of the law. 200bhp on the road is useless to me. Using less throttle on a bike that is capable of much more would take away my enjoyment of riding a motorcycle. I have been riding a tiny zxr400 and been enjoying that so much more than my 749 in terms of ride ability because I can wring its neck and still be at a speed compatible with road riding. It is my opinion that Ducati would do well to follow the 848 and offer a lower powered mini pani and I for one would buy one, even at a price point close to an 1199. For me riding isn't about how much horsepower I control in my right hand, it's how much I enjoy the ride I have, be that at 40mph or at 150mph. In my less than extensive experience, I found I spend most of my time riding within the boundaries of the law and an 1199 is not needed for those speeds. I also need to insure my bike. And the difference between an 1199 and an 899 could be several thousand pounds. For example my best quote on a KTM RC8 was £4000 fully comp, but only £600 on an 848. That's a considerable amount, enough to make anyone think twice about chasing BHP.
As a marketeer, I love looking at market data and trying to understand what is going on. I would say, looking at that data, that as bikers get older (and it is an older market), they want to do more stuff, not just hoon around at great speed. That's why you see the relative health of Adventure Sport and Touring bikes. It is interesting that Sport Touring is now an insignificant market segment. But I see these figures as partly self-fulfilling prophecies. Take Ducati - they have spurned the sports touring market and replaced it with Adventure Sport. In fact, strip out the BMW 1200GS and the Mutley and perhaps the KTM, and you barely have an Adventure Sports category. Where are the new exciting sports tourers? It's the same with the capacity designations. Some capacity segments are declining because the manufacturers don't make anything in this segment, or less than they did. The 999 was 1'000cc, then the 1098 was 1100cc and now it's all about 1200cc. I don't recall us all asking for 1200cc motorbikes. But sportsbikes are declining because not only are the riders getting older with creaking joints, but because the road environment is now ill adapted for them. Riding in Alsace on Friday, it was all slow-moving traffic, built-up areas and villages, and when finally I could let the thing off the leash - bam! - bloody speed cameras. The fun has just been legislated out of fast biking. Also interesting that Ducati don't even figure in the list of top manufacturers. Even KTM are ahead. Worrying for them?
Worrying only if they aren't turning a profit? If they aren't making as much profit as KTM but they can weather the financial climate until sunnier times, perhaps not so much. I think any business that can limit its losses and continue to function at the moment is doing well. When we all have some more money to spend, then they will all have more money to take! Also, KTMs new single cylinder 390 sports bike is another example of a lower powered sports bike focused on handling and not outright power. A win for the consumer in my eyes, and a win for a new generation of motorcycle riders who perhaps don't want the focus of their desires to be an 1199cc death machine but something more akin to the small capacity 2-strokes that the 'old' market cut their teeth on in the 80s and 90s
No, your answer is cos it's cheaper, mine is cos it's more popular. I don't believe the price is an overriding factor, you'd have to ask the people who bought them really.
Abree Fig, price was not a factor for me. I wanted something I could ride closer to its limits and need to be ridden fairly hard to make it fun. The big capacity stuff is just too easy, its nit fun its functional. Which is why I've bought a multi which is functional and a Il4 tou for track because thats he only place you can make it fun and I'm a ard arse and am sick of s1000rr's blapping me on straights and parking in corners...if you cant beat em, join em
That's a fairly eurocentric viewpoint. As has been pointed out, there are plenty of places where you can sell and make money and people like the German car manufacturers are doing so - China, for example. If you wait for the Euro market to turn around, you could be waiting a long time (and will go bust in the process). Asia, Brazil and places are working perfectly well. Europe has probably had it - things won't turn around any time soon. Equally though, as I noticed on the motorways of France, Germany, Belgium and Luxemburg (not to mention the UK) yesterday, there is no shortage of well-off people with flashy cars. But the bike manufacturers have failed to make motorcyclists out of them.
Or Eurocrats have succeeded in making it so unattractive and difficult its better to have a scooby-evo-R
The bike manufacturers have failed quite miserably, if you ask me, by simply ignoring the average Joe. They've concentrated on high-end bikes for too long, and effectively shrunk their captive audience in doing so. Thankfully a bunch of idiots in Brussels have given the manufacturers a target to aim for with the A2 license mob, and it may just save their bacon.
that old chestnut..........thats a riding issue that would be the same regardless of what 'they' were riding............
I think if you asked a lot of folk on here if they would buy a 120rwbhp Ducati sportsbike, the riding position of the Panigale without all the heat issues, DTC and ABS and looks great, then the answer would be yes. In fact you could even say 100rwbhp and it would still be fun on the road. Thats why i have kept my 748. Everyone has to make their own choices. I've done the 150bhp sportsbike thing and as much as it was fun for a while, i realised that the only way they stayed being fun to ride was to go faster and faster. Not good if you need your licence for work as well.
from the guy whos upgraded everything so it goes faster....I intend to park it in every corner I can and slow everyone else down. Awesome. Who needs corner speed when you have power!
thats what the electronics are for oh no hold on, I dont have traction or abs or any of that fancy fly by wire stuff...guess its just right wrist then
trust me it wont go fast on its own i have one of those 848 throttle things fitted!............plus who said i am going to park it in every corner i wont see you for dust as your a racer,...and finally have you ever studied or listened to any proper racers about the difference in riding style on a 600 compared to a superbike............
Could be worse.........i could of traded in me mickey mouse Ducati and bought a GSXR thousand............who needs power eh...
The smaller superbike Dukes surely sell on price. Put it this way, if they both cost the same, who'd buy the bike with less bhp? But people are happy to trade a few useless bhp for a saving of a few grand. That tells you how much they think the extra bhp is really worth to them - not that much. In the real world, it's much more useful to have a 150 mile tank range and 130 bhp, than a 100 mile (or 80 mile) tank range and 180 bhp. I find things like a couple of bungee hooks more useful in the real world than an extra 20 bhp. Call me weird, but I quite like going places on my bike.
You wont find me slating anyones riding, I expecting you to be quicker than me given you spend half your life on a bike and have done far more track time. You're in fast group, right? And yes, I do loads of reading and listening. Can I do it? No, not yet, but the most fun bit is the learning. Managed to transform my riding before and with a massive 50hp and 18st weight do some ok times around most tracks. Am I quick? Not really, especially not track days, mid-back fast group at best. Can I race? Yes because I'm aggressive, will pass anywhere and have a go forward attitude that I don't bring to trackdays unlike some others. Unless someone nearly has me off...All learnt that.
