SCUBA Diving

and the great PADI debate starts!!!

and I agree, PADI are just a commercial enterprise, I cannot believe that PADI allow divers into the open sea who have no rescue training skills, that's another module and cost, all BSAC and SAA members go through pool training and tests for rescue skills before going in the open water and then more open water rescues skills before advancing further, PADI, pay another dollar and you're in. Ok for tourist diving in shallow waters but pray they have done rescue skills, I have dived with PADI members who have done the odd dive in shallow clear waters and then fancy diving in the uk, very scary, they were missing the basic skills of checking first and second stages when getting kitted up and arms and legs were all over the place under the water.

i appreciate that this isn't always the case and there are some very good PADI divers out there, its down to individuals skills, instructor skills and common sense but in general PADI is shocking

 

defines it completely.........

 

all the BSAC guys badmouthing PADI might be interested to know that most commercial dive schools have a similar opinion of them, but their opinion of BSAC isn't much better either...

Edited to add that its not my opinion btw, I've dived with some very good BSAC divers as well as some very poor ones, the same goes with PADI. at the end of the day the quality of training is very important but not as important as the ability of the trainee to take it in and put it to use imo.

 

That's like saying professional driving courses have a low opinion of motoring schools.Of course they do, it's much less intense and very very definitely amateur. Silly statement.

 

Having been an instructor with both SAA and BSAC clubs I think its a far better way to learn, If one of my trainees is having a particular problem, whether its mask clearing, buddy breathing etc then I have the time to spend with them and help them until they get it right on a one on one basis, PADI is a course with time restrictions so the pupil has to move at the pace dictated to them regardless, good friend of mine when on a PADI course and felt rushed through, I have since spent a lot of time with him at places like Stoney and Chepstow to bring him up to speed and was shocked at his level of competancy or should I say lack of it. I would go through the basics like standard reg checks and amazed he had never been shown them. Shallow dives so plenty of dive time, again he was surprised when I said we would surface ON 50 bar. He thought you started to surface on 50 bar!!

 

I agree that my course was far more intense than the leisure courses some of my friends have done, however I can understand the opinions of the Commercial schools. I have dived with both PADI and BSAC qualified divers who struggled with the basics, can't clear masks, can't maintain buoyancy, can't ascend safely etc. On the commercial course if you can't do the basics you don't pass, end of, We started our course with 27 students, 12 passed. Yet these were supposedly qualified divers.

BSAC have some great instructors and superb instructional material and as I said before I have dived with some very very good BSAC qualified divers, however I have also dived with some very poor BSAC qualified divers too hence my comments on the ability of the trainee to put the training to use...

 

I am a PADI instructor and a BSAC advanced Diver with over 3000 dives logged saying that i have not dived for about 10 years and i found BSAC training very slow and it takes to long to get into the water ,but with PADI as it is based in warmer climate they prefer to do more training in safe conditions in the sea so they get a better idea of tide and swell , you dont get this pissing about in a pool. I have been a member of a few bsac clubs but don’t get on with the politics and all the "sporting Billys" all the gear with no idear and have dived with more numptys from clubs than i have with independent divers .
Im not saying PADI is better than BSAC but they are chalk and cheese PADI is a professional organisation run by professionals and BSAC is a club run by armatures but I think they both have something to offer .
Im very lucky I was brought up by the sea and I had very basic training and was told to read the BSAC hand book by a diver who worked for my farther who used to do all the maintenance on the moorings in the river exe , so I got trained to take over from him so I had to work in zero visibility all around the year mainly in the winter in water around 10 meters so nice and shallow but I always worked by myself, as that was the way it worked , but to be honest I felt safer diving on my tod and had a much more enjoyable dive than I did diving with some numpty you have to keep looking after all the time that’s why I gave up diver training and took up spearfishing

 

I did my BSAC training with a club that had a really good attitude to training and when you started you were trained with a buddy who would go through the whole program alongside you with the same instructor from start to finish and then when you did your first open water dives it'd be the same three people who went to Stoney Cove and that way you'd already got a reasonable relationship going between you.

I stopped after I'd done everything I wanted to do and didn't carry on to the next level after sport diver but when I was more active with the CDG it soon became obvious why they wouldn't accept PADI courses as even a substitute for basic pool training. The CDG training was pretty brutal and involved a lot of emergency drills but for obvious reasons they didn't dwell too long on rescue and most of the time you'd be diving alone.

 

i once went diving with a hard hat diver when i was working at the diving school as he wanted to brush up with working with scuba as all his training was with umbillical.
so we did a low viz navigation dive but after 5 mins i lost him as he bolted to the serface as he could not hack not having comms with the a dive controler or being tetherd to the dive platform and he found scuba way to scary .
but the next day i was teated to training with the hard hat group as they were short i diver so i had my first go at a Aquadine hard hat what fun except the dresser did not do up the bands tight enough and every time i bent over to undo some nuts on the training rig it flooded ,so i had to keep purging the dam thing out so i could breath apart from that a very enjoyable day and a very safe feeling knowing you could talk to the surface and you were tied to the top as well

 

Hard hat diving is great, especially in cold conditions as your whole head stays dry and warm. I liked diving with AGA masks and through water comms, you get all the bonuses of being able to chat to everyone but aren't tethered to a tender. Hard wire comms are much better quality though and if you are only working in one location it does make sense to be on a safety line.

 

I was a member of Cambridge University Underwater Exploration Group - ie the CU BSAC club when I was there. It was great to learn. Medical and physics students did the theory stuff, and then we'd do pool things and it was a great crowd. After 2 terms of this once a week, we went diving at Penzance at Easter for the qualification dives. More fun. Sadly, due to the weather, I only managed to do 7 out of 10, and I think I missed the F test as there wasn't enough equipment available that week. The following term we no longer had use of the pool, so it never got done. Some better organised people went off to a gravel pit to fill in the missing dives, I never did, so I never got my BSAC qualification.

13 years later, I did PADI in the Maldives and had to do everything from scratch again, but this was excellent revision and very simple for me, having already done it once.

In my view, the qualifications are a bit like anything - your basic entry ticket and then it's experience that counts and basic aptitude. People who rarely dive are never going to be as good as those who do it frequently. At the end of a two week diving holiday, I am way better than on the first day or two. I have dived with morons (and quickly asked to change buddies) and I have dived with really good people. Bit like motorcycling, really.

 

I did a couple of trips out to a dive support platform in the Gulf of Mexico and the divers said the work was great and the only bit that made them take a sharp intake of air was as they stepped out of the habitat because it was just a big step into a black void. I'd have loved to have had a go but I've never been prepared to go through all the training involved in becoming a commercial diver.

I was their best friend whenever I was there because I had to fix the positioning motors that stopped the rig from dragging them away from where they were working.

 

So, to sum it up, there are numptie BSAC divers AND numptie PADI divers. Commercial DIVERS are better trained. (wonder why?)

but......................

PADI are NOT professional divers in any sense other than that they take your money. NOBODY else would pay them for work done.

 

Ha great thread Rimpmeister, but PADI will always be pay- and- die -instantly . Although why BSAC thought they were superior is beyond me , I saw some shoddy practices whilst I was in training, leaving two divers behind because the instructor couldn't count the fingers on one hand for a start, and he was an ex navy diver ( probably saw them as expendable).
Once I'd completed my training I only ever dived with a buddy a couple of times , preferring to dive one up one down , (no-one to look out for) , dangerous I know but once your used to it I found it the best way to dive. We were always after fish, lobsters or *ormers ( *illegal to do over here), carrying a small hand spear.
This is bringing back some good memories.
I still have a couple of regs and cylinder somewhere and an old Alladin pro computer , alas the drysuit and stab jacket went a long time ago. I always wore a stab jacket with my drysuit because I'd learnt in one ,even though I didn't really need it anymore.
I wouldn't trust myself to 20ft anymore lol.

 

always had a small hand spear tucked in my knife strap , i got in the neck with my instuctor when i was doing my divemaster training , the instuctor was showing a very sweet girl student a very large plaice sat on the bottom and i was swimming just above them and i forgot myself saw the fish and stabbed with my knife felling very pleased with myself i showed it to the girl wile i was trying to get it into my goody bag , i got a big bollocking for that ,i did not know she was a vegi

 

:biggrin:

 

but was she a virgin?