I think the point is that the faulty starter has an effect on the ignition system which leads to a weak spark and poor starting, causes an electrical drain, it would be great if someone could loan the OP a known good starter to prove it out but I guess that’s unlikely.
Yes, Ducatis are prone to ignition problems when starting, due to there being insufficient current to both run the starting circuit and the ignition circuit if the starting circuit is less than optimal. This is why @Exige starting circuit cables are so popular. This is normally characterised by slow cranking though and the cranking speed of this bike is supposedly excellent
Thanks Guys all the feed back is great - just to recap I have excellent cranking speed, the spark is definitely weak, fuel isn't getting into the cylinders during cranking, I'm lead to believe this is normal as all things go together when right which leads to eventual firing up, I have ran an extra piggy back earth for tomorrows episode my mate with duc diagnostics will be over but even with the diagnostics this is proving challenging as no faults show up and the TPS has been reset and replaced. I haven't tried as yet with the piggy back earth. A few weeks ago we squirted some fuel into the cylinder and she fired up, once running its spot on its just getting to that stage, a bit of an unusual one I think, my duc mate cant see how it can be the starter motor when cranking is great but it could be taking the majority of the power, the fuel pump is activated during ignition but again its just getting it started...so annoying, will keep you posted after tomorrows episode. ps. my contact in England at a major dealership has said all along its the starter motor I think we will have this off tomorrow...help...thakyou Paul
Hi Steve, not in my time although I have a new one, my duc mate thinks this is unlikely as it runs so well when fired up with no issue what so ever with fueling...perhaps there's something going on but we cant see it being the fuel filter, also the spark is poor..oh the joys..Paul
Should have said all plugs were replaced and replaced again with NGK iridium's..we have looked over the leads for obvious damage etc but, again when it starts its perfect...
The fact it starts with extra fuel has to be key, surely. It's as though the ecu is not delivering fue or sufficient fuell when cranking. Are you sure about the TPS reset? Do you have a lever to increase idle speed as on a 999??
You say when you squirted petrol into the engine it fired up and once running is spot on. Suggests you may have a cold start enrichment issue, maybe sensor not giving right info to ecu or the ecu itself is not sending out right signal to inject enough fuel for the initial fire up? Maybe diagnostics will show something.
Yes, could it be an issue with the temperature sensor giving the ECU the wrong information, so the mixture just isn't rich enough for a winter temperature control old start??
Thanks guys great feedback much appreciated here's the update from today. Starter motor removed by my duc technician brushes in a very worn state. Although crank speed high - brushes are done, which is a bit of a contradiction, probably means windings are good however contact to them poor. I,m considering buying a complete starter motor rather than just brushes "just in case" will keep you posted if problem solved...thanks again for all your support..Paul..
Poor cold starting and worse when hot suggests a bad fuel/air ratio at closed throttle to me. Since it used to be ok and now isn't what has changed? A TPS reset has been done with no change so that can be ruled out. A faulty engine temperature sensor usually results in poor running which is not the case with this bike. These bikes have a servo controlled idle control valve which maintains the idle speed regardless of engine temperature by varying the amount of air bypassing the throttle butterflies. It should reset to a default position at ignition on. It is possible that it is partially gummed up, preventing it from returning fully to its default position so that the mixture is too lean or too rich for best starting. Removing the servo valve and cleaning it out with carb cleaner might help. Also check for air leaks in any of the hoses connected to the throttle bodies, most likely those to the servo valve. As a last resort try closing, or opening, the air bleeds by a 1/4 turn. Note their original position so that they can be put back if no change.
If re con starter does not fix it , check the battery volts with a meter as the bike does the extended cranking period ...see if it holds above around 10 volts I’ve seen loads of times on cars where they can crank over pretty well but not fire up , the starter takes all the battery’s power leaving very little residual voltage to run the other ignition on circuits this will have a big effect on quality of spark . I know you have had a new battery but some voltage readings will be good whilst cranking
Also .....have you a car battery ...just try putting jump leads on to the bike as well to see if extra battery capacity helps with the starting
Hi guys thanks again for the brilliant support this is very generous of you all, interesting note about the idle control valve. Today I ordered the starter motor not in stock but will have in about 10/12 days and also got hit for extra delivery to the frozen north I will if I can work it out put up a picture of the brushes) I'm hopeful the new starter motor will sort this, Kenny who has been helping me ( ex duc technician ) is reasonably confident too..here's hoping and keep you posted..Paul
These brushes are certainly pretty worn. I can't see the commutator very well in your photo but it seems to be in reasonable condition.
