My problem peter is your constant superior attitude your ability to find the tiniest of chinks and to elaborate on it. Irrespective of whether you stand by your own comments. You appear (to my eyes) to see this as a public forum to attempt to humiliate and minimise others by your use of language and your previously alluded to debating skills. Quite honestly it is tiresome and boring for me to read how yet again everyone else is wrong as you are right. This is a forum that represents a true reflection and cross section of society, each and everyone entitled to their own opinion. Yes no doubt you will put together a reasoned argument as to how you are only expressing your opinion, but why not allow others to do so with out crucifying them. I know I have crossed the line previously and have had the humility when I have over stepped the mark to apologise. You appear to sometimes see this forum as your own personal bait the pleb site. I have previously stated why don't you lighten up, I now realise that actually you enjoy being contrary, that you enjoy finding loopholes in others arguments. I won't go into the psychology of it, I just would have expected better from one so highly trained and so incredibly erudite and articulate. As I have previously said opinions and arseholes, and I no doubt have made myself out to be the latter.
There is a modern (around 60 years?) knowledge gap between the cow being born and the meat arriving at the table. I think that a lot of modern, educated, first world inhabitants would struggle with the process of slaughter and preparation for eating. A deer has it anus turned inside out with a barbed butt plug at the site of it's death so the guts can be removed without tainting the meat. The first thing to be cut off of the freshly killed deer are the testicles or the mammary glands to stop the meat spoiling. It's hung up by the legs and it's blood drained through an artery in the neck. The guts are left where they are removed for the local wildlife to consume and the head and 'shins' are cut off. Then it gets taken from the site and hung before being skinned the next day. While it's hanging from a rafter the hundreds of ticks that coat it drop off and will attach themselves to anything they can. Then the deer can be skinned, cut, stored or eaten. It's quite a violent, dirty and time consuming process that ends with a tasty steak on the table at the end. The old phrase that if you want to eat an omelette then you have to break some eggs is very true. If you want to eat veal then someone needs a baby cow to fatten up. If lots of people want to eat veal then he needs a lot of baby cows to fatten up. It's food and it's existence is entirely based on being eaten. Crocodiles drown their food by grabbing it with their mouth and dragging them in to the water; a cruel and terrifying death but we're not making a fuss about that.
I've never been rude to you @Pete1950 but the normal communication style of social beings is rather different to the one you usually apply in your posting. I'm sure most people recognise that you have a different way of thinking about topics and none would ever accuse you of being stupid. As human beings we (most of us) value personal relationships and effectively being nice to each other and being liked in return. There was a survey done of people in palliative care asking what they regretted the most from their lives. Not one said they wished they had been more successful or earnt more money. Most wished they had spent more time with family and friends or had travelled more. I'd personally hate to get to the end of my life (whenever that may be) knowing that I had won lots of arguments but rubbed people up the wrong way. What a waste that would be.
Is the quality of life they lead before they are killed important to you ? If they have not known anything else does that make inhumane treatment OK ? Cows form friendships and hold grudges, they are distressed when their calves are taken away soon after they are born and before they are weaned. Does cheap dairy products justify this suffering ? There is a strong correlation between the consumption of dairy products and certain types of cancer with the suspicion that natural growth hormone in cows milk causes cancer to multiply at an increased rate. Then there is the question of whether feeding cows to produce meat and milk is an efficient use of natural resources. It could be argued that it is better to eat grain (or grow soya instead) to feed the world than produce meat. I enjoy good quality meat and am prepared to eat less and pay a bit more for that quality and in doing so I also hope that animal husbandry improves.
That is exactly what it implies. I don't suppose it was photoshopped and just because you can't see the animals doesn't mean that they aren't there. This is not a court of law.
There is no justification for making any creatures suffer. Happy life and a quick death. That will do for me and I hope is what the animals I eat get. Take the trouble to find out where your food comes from and how it grew/lived. Too much centralisation and industrial farming in the name of cheap food and efficiency , I question how cheap it is anyway. Look at the costs of foot and mouth and mad cow disease let alone the health implications of spending your life consuming food over dosed with medication and pesticide .
The comments assume that a natural life is better than one in a box, feed and watered and healthy. Because nature isn't full of disease, predators, the struggle for food, keeping warm, the struggle for a mate, adverse weather, dangerous environments and parasites.
How a deer is cleaned after it is shot and how crocodiles kill their prey has little to do with how we, as humans, raise animals for food. To say "It's food and it's existence is entirely based on being eaten." does not justify cruelty.
No one would dispute that nature is red in tooth and claw but we are discussing the treatment of farm reared animals.
So define cruelty? They're not harmed until they are killed. They're fed enough, cared for by a vet. Enough to eat and access to healthcare is better than a lot of people around the world.
Humans are part of nature and thus are also red in tooth and claw. We are not separate to the natural world but a part of it. A farm reared animal has a better time of it than a wild one.
I'm relieved to hear that all of this nastiness is performed AFTER the deer has been killed. As for the hundreds (!) of ticks - that explains why the dog has now picked up several, and I've even had one on myself (fortunately it did not get a proper meal from me). They are truly horrible little animals, and I feel no regret when I kill one, although I would not squash their cousins, the spiders.
Compare a battery chicken farm with a free range one , that should help define cruelty. It is incorrect imo to say they are not harmed until they are killed.
